Paypal Issues.

[Pinarelloman]

In February I sold a Sigma lens on ebay to a guy in Italy. He used paypal for payment and I offered $20 postage & another $20 for insurance. He declined the insurance & I have now received a not received item dispute & they may potentially take the money back from my credit card.
He refused the insurance so he should be out of pocket, not me.
Anyone else had this happen?

[Old Skool]

No, but if you look around vendors selling on EBay, they won't sell to you if you live in Italy, so must be a problem with the slow postal system / customs there. Might still turn up??

[Philr]

Actually I had an issue with an item I sold on ebay recently (my first issue) and I frequently sell on there. I sold an item to a amatuer photographer in Sydney, the item was brand new, never been out of the box except for me to inspect it. It was in perfect condition. The item sold for $82, and RRP was around $95. Postage cost me about $9 but I charged $10. A week passed and I got an email from the person saying they had a problem, they claimed the item was used, had scratches and dints etc. I repliead back asking for photo evidence and they said that their camera was in the shop getting repaired. So I asked them to return the item if they were not happy with it at my expense. They said they had not the time or money but wanted cash compensation instead. I refused.

They then proceeded to leave negative feedback for me, my first btw. So I left negative feedback for them. I though good that was all that was going to happen. WRONG! 2 days later we have a paypal dispute open claiming a they recieved damaged and faulty goods and also claiming I had caused her distress with the transaction. I don't know how she did it as Paypal could not explain to me but she had claimed $200??? Paypal has frozen my account indefinately, and also taken this $200 out of my credit card as my account had only $5 in it until they investigate it further. I have emailed paypal quite a few times over the past few weeks and I am still awaiting a reply as to why she can ask for more than twice the value in a refund...???

Needless to say, pending a good or a bad outcome, Paypal has lost my buisness in the future!

[JM Tran]

I hate Paypal

as the buyer always has the advantage over the seller, thus many can abuse it and use it to scam honest sellers

[MarkW]

In February I sold a Sigma lens on ebay to a guy in Italy. He used paypal for payment and I offered $20 postage & another $20 for insurance. He declined the insurance & I have now received a not received item dispute & they may potentially take the money back from my credit card.
He refused the insurance so he should be out of pocket, not me.
Anyone else had this happen?

Do you have evidence that you posted the product?? If you do then photocopy said evidence and use this to fight the claim with.

These days many sellers won't sell unless the transaction is insured.

[Pinarelloman]

No, unfortunately I was too trusting of Aussie Post & as the item was uninsured, the receipt was discarded long ago.
The receipt would only have had the price total on it & not the item destination.

Thanks anyway for the replies, but I think this will be ugly.

I have no proof I posted the item & he has no proof he did not receive it.

Thanks.

[peterb666]

No, unfortunately I was too trusting of Aussie Post & as the item was uninsured, the receipt was discarded long ago.
The receipt would only have had the price total on it & not the item destination.

Thanks anyway for the replies, but I think this will be ugly.

I have no proof I posted the item & he has no proof he did not receive it.

Thanks.

Never send anything without proof of sending. Registration is essential even if it comes out of your own pocket. Unless things have changed recently, Australia Post does not offer additional insurance to Italy due to the high loss rate/poor delivery in Italy. I don't ship to Italy.

BTW, it is only in Australia Post's hands until it leaves the country. They cannot be held reponsible for delivery in a foreign country.

[dsaini]

I had similar issue with PayPal. I bought D90 as my D3 was gone for repairs, suddenly i got the chance to get a second hand D3 for cheap and i snapped it. Tried to sell D90 on eBay (i didn't even took a single picture with D90). Buyer insisted on PayPal even tough i was offering him to come and pick up the item and pay cash.

Ended up doing it via PayPal. Next thing i know PayPal locked my account for SUSPICIOUS activity and locked me out. Buyer claimed he sent me the money and i should send him the item. I told him i got no access to PayPal, he is welcomed to come to my house to pick up the camera and show me that he did transferred the money on his account or i can come to his house and he can show me there and he refused to even do so.

He ended up leaving -ve feedback for me and eBay is still demanding around $70 for the sale and PayPal has been sending me constant messages telling to sort out the issue, yet both eBay and PayPal refuse to answer my emails.

Why should someone bother with PayPal when seller's get raped?

/Rant

[Wayne]

As a seller, you must use registered post, and specify that delivery is to the named person only, ie: no agent allowed to collect on addressee behalf which is an option with registered post.

This will prove that you sent "an" item, but of course not what specifically you sent, or what condition said item was in. This will then stop alot of item not received claims, but still leave you open to item not as described claims, then the buyer has to return the item at their cost registered post. Usually they won't bother if they are trying to scam, and the claim expires as they can't provide proof of eturning the item to you.

The golden rule with Paypal is, never ever use a bank account that you keep funds in, and as soon as funds from a seller appear in your Paypal account, move those funds to another account Paypal have no access to. When Paypal receive a dispute, they draw on your Paypal balance or bank account if you have one on file in the hope of locking the $$ up until the issue is resolved, and they use the bank account over the credit card as it offers little protection for you if you dispute the transaction, where as a credit card has mandatory chargeback options, and without a signed slip authorising payment, any charge they make to that card cannot be proven as an authorised transaction and the bank will draw the funds from their account if you lodge a dispute.

If they have taken $$ from your credit card, contact your bank asap, state that it is an unauthorised transaction and you want to file a chargeback, you will get your money back, probably from Paypal on the 6th day after you lodge the dispute, because they know full well that they will get drawn on on the 7th day as they cannot prove it was authorised, and they try to look like a good corporate citizens by returning your money rather than have another statistic on file where they had to be subject to having the $$ forcibly removed from their account, they think it keeps them in good light with the RBA and other regulators.

[Pinarelloman]

Thanks for the advice.
I have been advised by paypal that unless the seller can provide proof of the item being sent, then you will be held liable if the item is not received by the purchaser. So in my case, even though he declined insurance on checkout, I am the liable party.

The item arrived in Italy on the 2nd April. 6 weeks after being posted.

Next time full insurance, or no post.
Thankis for the replies.

[pgbphotographytas]

I refuse to use Paypal at all....

[MarkW]

The item arrived in Italy on the 2nd April. 6 weeks after being posted.

If you know that the item arrived in Italy, is that not proof that you sent the item?

If its only been 6 weeks, isn't this a little premature to be ringing the alarms bells yet as a no show? Things coming from the US can take 8 to 10 weeks if sent by ship.

Or is it all over and the article has been received.

[Pinarelloman]

Yes, the item has been received.
The buyer raised the alarm bells after only 3 weeks.
Paypal notified me after 1 month had elapsed.

[Alpacamike]

Without going in to detaisl, within the last month I have had a similar problem with Paypal and Ebay, I decided the best plan of action was to close both accounts, but what I unfortunately have to remember is to close my bank account as well, because as my bank manager reminded me that the bank cannot stop Paypal from taking money from my account as it was an agreement between me the account holder and Paypal and actually nothing to do with the bank, It’s a minefield.
Alpacamike

[Tannin]

Paypal is notorious for this stuff. See http://www.paypalsucks.com I have always been too afraid of Paypal to ever use them for anything.

[Philr]

My dispute was closed a few weeks ago, Paypal decided the outcome because they can do that.... $92 refunded to the buyer, no goods returned... even though I offered a full refund in exchange for goods. I was very dissapointed with the outcome and my account is still suspended. The buyer has no rights when it comes to disputes like this. I will never use Paypal again.