D800 is here..

[I @ M]

Here is a link to an video interview with Jim Brandenburg after a month with the D800 which you might find interesting.

http://www.whatdigitalcamera.com/vid...andenburg.html

Very good bit of advertising in that video but if he is being ridgey didge then the camera is a really excellent tool.

[gqtuazon]

Cool, I've been looking for that every now and again. Here is a link to an video interview with Jim Brandenburg after a month with the D800 which you might find interesting.

http://www.whatdigitalcamera.com/vid...andenburg.html

After watching it, I'm a bit worried about my choice! It is a lot of camera for an ametaur!

Thanks for the link.

It just means that we need to exercise more precision to perfect our skills.

[rodw]

Thanks for the link.

It just means that we need to exercise more precision to perfect our skills.

I agree. There is a lot of technology today that makes us lazy. Being forced to focus on technique learnt with film decades ago won't be a bad thing. I was interested in his comments about Auto modes, JPEG's and Active-D.

[bxaftw]

where is the cheapest aus stock pre order for this camera?

[rodw]

where is the cheapest aus stock pre order for this camera?

It's not what you pre-order at, but what you end up paying.

Some homework is required, but don't pay over about $3,400 and if you are really lucky, you might screw the price down to $3,000 or a tad less.

[arthurking83]

....... I was interested in his comments about Auto modes, JPEG's and Active-D.

Active D-Light is known to work very well.. but at the expense of full control over the image. That is, ADL has been known to alter the cameras parameters to some values it deemed to be more appropriate.
In every day shooting this is not an issue, but if there was a 'scientific requirement' for any of the camera's settings to be shot at precise values, ADL could compromise that precision.

I'm fairly sure(but not 100%) that when Jim Brandenburg meant "auto modes" he was referring to shutter/aperture or Auto ISO modes .. not so much scene modes as many people would instinctively think of.

Reasons I'm thinking this is because the D800 will not have any of the usual array of Auto scene modes that most folks associate with the term "Auto modes".
I tend to view these so called semi auto modes, such as aperture and shutter priority as semi manual modes!(you're still required to make a conscious, manual decision for at least one variable!! ).
Either way, it's the same definition, just a different way of looking at it.

Nothing wrong with shooting jpgs. There is always some extra detail available in a raw file that can't be rendered in an in camera jpg, but when that last 1% of image quality is simply not an important consideration and speed of workflow is, then jpg can be an appropriate file type to use.(just ask any sports photographer!)

[rodw]

Arthur, thanks for your observations, what you say about Auto makes sense. I've never used the scene modes but it is very interesting to hear somebody of Jim's stature saying the camera is smarter than he is and how small the difference is between RAW and JPEG. I think as technology advances, we need to keep reassessing what file formats we use.

[I @ M]

where is the cheapest aus stock pre order for this camera?

I feel that anyone ordering one now will be waiting till at least the 2nd delivery of bodies if not the 3rd. Demand is enormous for this body. Forget about trying to find one at a cheap price as some of the stores that set a low price to start with have already increased their prices due to demand.

Some homework is required, but don't pay over about $3,400 and if you are really lucky, you might screw the price down to $3,000 or a tad less.

$3400.00 ish seems to be the generally accepted street price for an Australian delivered body. As I mentioned in the post above, the prices are already rising at some stores due to demand.
To put it simply Rod, I reckon you are dreaming if you reckon you can buy an Australian delivered body under the street price within the first 6 - 12 months.

[rodw]

ITo put it simply Rod, I reckon you are dreaming if you reckon you can buy an Australian delivered body under the street price within the first 6 - 12 months.

We'll see, some of us put our pre-orders in before the RRP was announced by Nikon and the street price was established so we had not agreed on a price. At that time, my vendor said he would price match so there is a conversation that I will be having. However, if you are ordering now, that conversation probably is not going to go anywhere.

The rest of your comments I agree with. The reason I went with a pre-order was becasue I though that there would be so much demand that it would always be on backorder so there would be no reason for the vendors to discount the price so I do expect prices to rise. Pre-Tsunami you could have got a D700 for about $300 less than today's price so there is some volatility in the street prices over time.

[I @ M]

We'll see, some of us put our pre-orders in before the RRP was announced by Nikon and the street price was established so we had not agreed on a price. At that time, my vendor said he would price match so there is a conversation that I will be having.

Yep, that "some of us" includes our order for 2 bodies placed well before prices were released by Nikon and in fact even before there was a stock # in their system. Having seen the "buy" price for a non Nikon pro dealer if your retailer is going to price match the grey importers he is either very generous and wealthy or determined to go out of business ----
I have already heard stories of some larger retailers telling their early orderers that they weren't quite as "early" as they initially thought and that they will have to wait for the "next" shipment --- at a dearer price of course.

[Redgum]

What a premium we pay for time! In just six months the D800, like most camera bodies before it, will probably be at least 20% cheaper. At the end of the year I'll be able to get two bodies for the price of one. Thank you early adopters, you've just saved me a fortune.
And for those who can't do firmware updates buying early can be a hazard.

[bxaftw]

I was just curious to see what the real world price is/will be, to compare with canons offering. I'm not a nikon user.

Your observation is correct redgum, however for many, time is more valuable than the premium they pay.

[Redgum]

Your observation is correct redgum, however for many, time is more valuable than the premium they pay.

Oh! You mean those over 70?
In reality time has no value it's just what you do with it. Buying a new camera body doesn't come into that league.

[rodw]

I think timing all depends on individual circumstances, in my case I was invited to write a few paid articles for a magazine which also required some photography and found 6 megapixels a limiting factor. Single page spreads were OK, but double page spreads were out of the question. I looked at buying a body 12 months ago and agonised over the FX v's DX decision and eventually decided to go FX. I think you need to make this decision for springing for the lenses or you won't get a good focal length footprint. I found out there was a replacement for the D700 on the way so I decided to spend some money on lenses and wait it out. Now I have a good selection of FX lenses so I need to buy the body to go with them to capitalise on my investment on glass. Sure I could buy a D700 but would you choose older technology at this point on the technology curve?

Whilst 36 mp is more than I wanted, it does lend itself to my desire to move from technical style writing to more travel and landscape material which the D800 will shine for.

I seriously doubt that the D800 price will fall any time soon as Nikon AU appear to have dropped their margins, Nikon JP need the cashflow after Tsunamis and floods and the competition has entered the marked at a $450 or so premium. There were 60 people in Brissy for a demo of the D800 and about 20 for the demo of the 5D Mk III. Canon I think has a much greater production capacity than Nikon and the size of their first shipment in Australia suprised Canon Australia, so there will be plenty of supply.

If my chosen dealer has over 200 pre-orders for the D800 then Nikon's 30,000 per month production capacity won't go very far around the world!

If there is going to be any market pricing adjustment, I would expect to see the 5D Mk III come down in price particularly if Canon AU is stuck with surplus stock that is not moving as they will have Canon JP breathing down their back about sales performance!

As you say, time will tell but what's a firmware upgrade or two between friends?

[swifty]

Even if demand wasn't through the roof for a D800, I highly doubt we'll see a 20% discount for street prices even if supply finally catches up. Let alone a 2 for today's price type of scenario.
IMO the D800's already aggressively priced and 20% off puts it at $2400 USD and 50% discount puts it at $1500 USD. It would be nice but I somehow doubt it.
I think $2400 towards end of life (2016) would be more likely or 2014 if a D800s appears mid-life.

[Redgum]

Even if demand wasn't through the roof for a D800, I highly doubt we'll see a 20% discount for street prices even if supply finally catches up. Let alone a 2 for today's price type of scenario.
IMO the D800's already aggressively priced and 20% off puts it at $2400 USD and 50% discount puts it at $1500 USD. It would be nice but I somehow doubt it.
I think $2400 towards end of life (2016) would be more likely or 2014 if a D800s appears mid-life.

History doesn't support that statement at all. Given an RRP of $3400.00 now for the D800 it's a reality that in six months the price will be $2720.00. Just look at the price of the D700 and it had a dramatic fall in the dollar during that period. I bought a new D700 (second one) six weeks ago for $A1790.00. The D800 will go the same way to be sure.
Just look at my D3x. Originally just under $12k, two years later they were around $6k and now under $3k. Almost the same debate people have over cars.

[Redgum]

I think timing all depends on individual circumstances, in my case I was invited to write a few paid articles for a magazine which also required some photography and found 6 megapixels a limiting factor. Single page spreads were OK, but double page spreads were out of the question. I looked at buying a body 12 months ago and agonised over the FX v's DX decision and eventually decided to go FX. I think you need to make this decision for springing for the lenses or you won't get a good focal length footprint. I found out there was a replacement for the D700 on the way so I decided to spend some money on lenses and wait it out. Now I have a good selection of FX lenses so I need to buy the body to go with them to capitalise on my investment on glass. Sure I could buy a D700 but would you choose older technology at this point on the technology curve?

Whilst 36 mp is more than I wanted, it does lend itself to my desire to move from technical style writing to more travel and landscape material which the D800 will shine for.

I seriously doubt that the D800 price will fall any time soon as Nikon AU appear to have dropped their margins, Nikon JP need the cashflow after Tsunamis and floods and the competition has entered the marked at a $450 or so premium. There were 60 people in Brissy for a demo of the D800 and about 20 for the demo of the 5D Mk III. Canon I think has a much greater production capacity than Nikon and the size of their first shipment in Australia suprised Canon Australia, so there will be plenty of supply.

If my chosen dealer has over 200 pre-orders for the D800 then Nikon's 30,000 per month production capacity won't go very far around the world!

If there is going to be any market pricing adjustment, I would expect to see the 5D Mk III come down in price particularly if Canon AU is stuck with surplus stock that is not moving as they will have Canon JP breathing down their back about sales performance!

As you say, time will tell but what's a firmware upgrade or two between friends?

Rod, as some here would know I'm a publisher for a national glossy mag and a shooter for National Geo (have been for close on 30 years). Don't get hung up on megapixels, in the real world they have little bearing on your work if you are a good photographer. I've been shooting stuff for billboards on the D700 for years (12.1mp) and no one has complained. My D3x is better for studio stuff but that's pretty rare these days.
A full frame camera is great for most mags but I have to admit a lot of stuff I receive for publication is further down the chain.
As for the Brissy demo it just goes to show there are still a lot of tyre kickers out there.
Business wise, even with depreciation, there's little value in buying at the top of the market.
Like all technology, prices will drop rapidly, particularly when Nikon include the same sensor in their next consumer release.
BTW: Firmware upgrades can make a hell of a difference particularly if the manufacturer fixes or activates a feature that wasn't ready at point of release. Happens regularly.

[swifty]

Hmm.. How did u buy a new D700 for $1790. Think many of us would like to know your secret
Are we comparing Aussie stock with Aussie stock or RRP at launch in Aust vs cheapest world wide prices? If the latter, then it's not exactly a fair comparison.

As for the D3x, probably better to use the D3 and D3s as historical indicators since they were popular models (like the D800 will be) and unlike the D3x.
Again using apples to apples comparison, can't remember what the D3 or D3s was priced at at launch but think its around $7k? Has it been sold anywhere near $3500 new for Aussie stock?
If so... Oh mannnm I missed out. If its still available at around $3500 can somebody please tell me where I can get one at that price.

Lastly, the high end models have far greater margins. And hence the ability to discount.
How low can it cost to make a D800 given an FX sensor can cost up to 20x a DX one although I'm sure Sony's improved their yields quite a bit which would translate to cheaper FX sensors.

[swifty]

Actually I hope you're right. A D800 at $2720 would be pretty hard to resist I hope my wife don't read these boards.

[swifty]

Hang on, did u write D3x under $3k??!! Where?!!