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Thread: Colour "Color" Space Setting Help Required Please

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    Colour "Color" Space Setting Help Required Please

    Can any boby help with a truth or myth. When you change the colour space in the camera from SRGB to ADOBE RGB, does that allow more colour saturation to be used/absorbed? I was made/or have understood it right/wrong that when set in Adobe RGB, the camera senor is able to use a greater colour area to apply to the saving image. From my Canon manual "http://media.the-digital-picture.com/Owners-Manuals/Canon-EOS-50D-Manual.pdf"

    Could somebody put it into simple english/laymans terms. Why have the two settings in the camera then? I think I understand the principle to a colour computor monitor, Amount of different colour in a specific colour space, as in 2000 reds rather than 200 in SRGB? Is this right and does that reflect dirrectly to the way the sensor interupts the image and saves it ???

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    Ausphotography Regular junqbox's Avatar
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    The different colour arrays (sRGB, AdobeRGB & ProPhoto) represent how many different colours can be achieved in each setting. ProPhoto has the broadest range, particularly in the yellow area, but it is unlikely you will be able to find someone who print the images out in that array, hence you colours will be 'clipped' and end up looking flat. AdobeRGB is between the two and some pro-labs can handle this array and print your images without any 'clipping' thus giving you what you see on screen. sRGB is the 'smallest' array and is likely to give you no troubles with having your images printed, as it is the most commonly used.
    If you are only ever going to use your images on screen, there is less impact of what you see on your monitor and what others will see, although ProPhoto can still be a risk if you're intending to use it for global viewing, eg- commercial websites, etc.

    This link will help you get a better understanding and has illustrations of where the differences are-
    http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tu...hoto-rgb.shtml

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    Thanks for the explanation but it gives me another doubt, If you set the camera in Adobe RGB, do all pp in that format and convert it in software (LR, PS, other) to sRGB only before sending to print, would it give better result than working from sRGB from the start?

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    Ausphotography Regular junqbox's Avatar
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    Ultimately, if all of your images are only ever going to be 'displayed' (printed or otherwise) in a particular array, then that would be the main one to work in. I tend to shoot AdobeRGB, because there may be some clipping of the array after conversion to sRGB for printing, sometimes it's not enough to be a problem. As there are also occassions when I might have it printed in AdobeRGB, and there's no point in short changing myself.
    It would be a similar scenario to to only taking all of your images as lo-res JPEGs, which will restrict your ability to PP or print in a broader range of sizes.

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    I would like to thank Richard Hill for putting me onto Arthur Kings links which explained it perfectly. I just wish I new how to attach Arthur's links? I'll try this

    http://www.ausphotography.net.au/for...read.php?75348

    http://www.ausphotography.net.au/for...read.php?71700

    http://www.ausphotography.net.au/for...read.php?43124

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patagonia View Post
    Thanks for the explanation but it gives me another doubt, If you set the camera in Adobe RGB, do all pp in that format and convert it in software (LR, PS, other) to sRGB only before sending to print, would it give better result than working from sRGB from the start?

    regards
    ........ do all your shooting and PP in Adobe 1998....... do not convert to sRGB for printing as most printer driver's will sort that out........
    Last edited by Big Pix; 02-02-2011 at 11:06am.

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    Ausphotography Addict Richard Hall's Avatar
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    Working in and shooting in a colour space are two different things altogether. RAW files have no colour space assigned to them as such. When you import them into your post-processing software is when you start working with an image in a designated colour space. So if you're shooting in RAW and set a working colour space in your camera it makes absolutely no difference to the RAW files. Setting a colour space in camera only affects images shot in JPG.

    I still can't understand why you'd work in a colour space such as AdobeRGB (or ProRGB) if your monitor isn't capable of displaying the gamut of that particular colour space!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Hall View Post
    Working in and shooting in a colour space are two different things altogether. RAW files have no colour space assigned to them as such. When you import them into your post-processing software is when you start working with an image in a designated colour space. So if you're shooting in RAW and set a working colour space in your camera it makes absolutely no difference to the RAW files. Setting a colour space in camera only affects images shot in JPG.

    I still can't understand why you'd work in a colour space such as AdobeRGB (or ProRGB) if your monitor isn't capable of displaying the gamut of that particular colour space!
    Hay Richard, So then if you have the camera settings at Max File size for Raw + what ever in Jpeg/Jpg say Medium and the colour space on the camera set to ARGB, does that affect the jpg/jpeg and the Jpg/jpeg embeded in the RAW file as Arthur was mentioning (I did't release the RAW had an enbeded image) and then if your monitor is ARGB capable, that would be the best settings, if not it make no sense to use ARGB and to stick with SRGB on a standard commercial laptop or home monitor.??? Added to that if i use ARGB and use CS5 PS and save it in ARGB, then I can print in the larger gamit colour scale? Is that right? Think I'm confusing myself.

    So for me, if my laptop which i'll presume dosen't have ADOBERGB capable res/colour it's pointless to set camera to Argb. Late model IE7 BLah Blah.
    Last edited by Roosta; 02-02-2011 at 4:03pm.

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    dont forget to use ARGB or anything effectively one has to calibrate their monitors effectively first!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JM Tran View Post
    dont forget to use ARGB or anything effectively one has to calibrate their monitors effectively first!
    That could lead me to ask another question then. If I was to ask, Are those "Spider" monitor calibraters worth it. Once you've set the monitor with then, what do you use it for? Allowing your monitor is capable of seeing/displaying full gamit Argb.

    I understand JM, that if my monitor can't use the gamit of ARGB it won't display the full colour array to.

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    Ausphotography Addict Richard Hall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roosta View Post
    Hay Richard, So then if you have the camera settings at Max File size for Raw + what ever in Jpeg/Jpg say Medium and the colour space on the camera set to ARGB, does that affect the jpg/jpeg and the Jpg/jpeg embeded in the RAW file as Arthur was mentioning (I did't release the RAW had an enbeded image) and then if your monitor is ARGB capable, that would be the best settings, if not it make no sense to use ARGB and to stick with SRGB on a standard commercial laptop or home monitor.??? Added to that if i use ARGB and use CS5 PS and save it in ARGB, then I can print in the larger gamit colour scale? Is that right? Think I'm confusing myself.

    So for me, if my laptop which i'll presume dosen't have ADOBERGB capable res/colour it's pointless to set camera to Argb. Late model IE7 BLah Blah.
    That's correct! The colour space setting in-camera only affects the embedded JPG (what you see on the camera's LCD and often as thumbnails in applications) in the RAW file and the separate JPG if you're also shooting in JPG+RAW.

    As to what's best to work in, I guess that's up to the individual and your needs. You'd have to keep in mind what output devices (monitors/printers) and their associated colour space requirements/capabilities are and work those requirements into your workflow.

    Neither my monitor nor printer can output the full AdobeRGB colour space, so I work entirely in the sRGB colour space, this makes most sense to me as most of my images are output for web display anyway.

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    yes, because it will adjust the colour temperature, brightness and contrast

    everytime ive run a spyder calibration over a monitor, even a laptop, im amazed at the difference it makes
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    Thanks again Richard, I actualy read something quite different in a "quality DSLR mag" that has left me thinking not to believe everything I read thats put out be so called experts. So thanks for the clarification.

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    Hey Roosta I have spyder and if we meet sometime I can calibrate your monitor....for a bundy and coke can that is or a nice cold beer LOL Here I urge you to buy a decent monitor at least 21'', calibrate it and use in post production.
    I've learned the colour space the hard way unfortunately. but....simply use sRGB if your images will be shown only on web sites. None of the current LCD monitors (if I'm correct) can show adobeRGB as its gamut is very limited by the emitted spectrum of the backlight. So.
    sRGB is absolutely fine for web
    Use adobeRBG if you are about to print you photos.
    use ProPhoto if you are about to have some high quality printing. Never printed anything in high q so don't know details.

    My cam is capturing adobeRGB always. Then a backup copy of the RAW file is made and I usually work on a copy with Spyder calibrated colour space unless I want to print the result.

    Not sure if that helps but I hope it does
    Last edited by PhoTomD; 02-02-2011 at 6:17pm.
    Treat my comment not as a critique but more like another point of view and please, share yours on my photos

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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi View Post
    yes, because it will adjust the colour temperature, brightness and contrast

    everytime ive run a spyder calibration over a monitor, even a laptop, im amazed at the difference it makes
    Thanks mate, have heard different things, Have you used it on a laptop? And did you find the same results as with the monitor?

    At this stage, the wife and I only have laptops, will be getting a "Decent" PC soon, just not sure on monitor, Alot of talk on the Dell U2410.

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    Thanks Tom, B & C not a problem, may even join you in one whilst the spyder does it's thing. Might have some time free on Tuesday 15th, will be away in Denmark (South West) weekend of the 11-13. Taking a Canon 300mm F4 L and a Canon 10-22mm with me, should hopefully get some good shots.

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    Then B&C it is Text me if you want to meet somewhere and have fun in Denmark! BTW not same result on big LCD's and small laptops. If you haven't done any calibration on your laptop before you will take some decent time to get used to its colours after calibration.

    and by a MAC lol! not a PC

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    It does work on a laptop within limitations of the laptop.

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    Yeah, was thinking of getting a Mac for home. Not sure tho yet. Shall do. Cheers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi View Post
    It does work on a laptop within limitations of the laptop.
    Cheers Kiwi.

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