Commercial web site development

[ricktas]

Unfortunately comments like:

* doesn't involve an ongoing parasite tax on your sales
* doesn't involve selling your first born to pay for the development
* Image sales on the web is a brave new world and there is no shortage of developers who want more than they deserve for their effort.

come across as seeking someone cheap, and that web developers generally are parasites and overcharge! Maybe it is a case of miscommunication or poor choice of wording, but it is what is reflected back in the answers from several members in this thread. So any replies that fit your 'it seems that assumption rules', are just replying to the wording you have given us. So rather than assume everyone else is wrong, maybe a quick review of your own posts might reveal why assumptions were made.

[ricstew]

A bit off topic but hey I just did a quote for a custom made corset....you know the type.......think steel bones ( imported ), custom pattern, grommets down the back, fully laced, steel boning in the front ( also imported )........it will suck you in and push you up and turn you into a true S shape ( Ok guys think Queen Victoria NOT Victoria's secret ) for a plus size Many many hours of work........ Well blow me down ........no it couldn't be ready next weekend.........no I am not cheaper than Ebay......by all means buy one from Ebay......no I will not alter one from Ebay and please don't come to me if the dang Ebay thing cuts you or falls to pieces...............you get what you pay for
cheers
Jan

[kiwi]

$6000 in my world (commercial software development) is about 5 days work, or $100 an hour (by the way quite a reasonable without being excessive rate for a photographer). Sounds about right for custom web development on any real consequence.

[Kym]

Daz... Can I quote you at work ?

[kiwi]

Sure Kym, just don't mention my real name

[Kym]

Just to fill everyone in on the joke. The company Kiwi works for supplies high end software to the company I work for (it even works rather well ).
Lets just say they charge a little more than $100/hr for services.

[kiwi]

Yip, im not really sure of the charge rates for small web developers, but if it's less than $100 an hour I'd be really surprised

[rellik666]

Just a side note, my work recently had their website redeveloped, it is now a very simple site with some interaction but not a lot and I provided many of the pictures.

This site cost about $6000 to produce and was well worth the money. As a very part time developer (i.e I can write a site if I have to) I know how much time and effort goes into an effective site. And to get a good result it costs time... QED it is costs money.

I am pretty sure there are web developers out there for every single price bracket....and most I wouldn't go near...you have to find one that produces the result you are looking for....no-one knows what that will cost until you explain it. A cheap company will produce a cheap site....it is the same with anything....you do get what you pay for.

I can provide you with the developer we used if you like.

[Redgum]

And just keep in mind there are other alternatives to those already covered - with a few stipulations of course.
Many universities and TAFE colleges will do web site development free of charge for selected applicants as part of their stundent development program. But you should allow at least one semester, maybe two for completion. The job will be managed professionally and it forms part of the assessment process.
The language in you application will need to be smart and businesslike as there is plenty of competition. The results can be spectacular.

[mcdesign]

Just to add my bit, it takes months to develop and design a site like the one you want, nobody works for nothing, so apart form doing it yourself and going through the long winded process of learning the different programs to do it with, (adding a cart is a brain taxing job apart form learning CS Style sheets!) Redgums idea sounds good if you can wait, sorry I can't be more positive, but it isn't a just pick up and do business!

[mwphoto]

Well, again I reiterate, I began this post to get useable advice. I do however, believe that the figures I have been quoted are excessive (>$6000).

It seems that assumption rules. Some in this forum assumed that I wanted to pay less than sweat shop rates; and I assumed that I would get some useful information that would assist me to find a solution to a question. Unfortunately, on this occasion, no one goes home with a cigar for either theory.
.

Useable information: $6000 is about the minimum price you should be looking at for your requirements - and the very valid reason you were given Redbubble and Smugmug as viable alternatives. What you have said you require is a product that will take a large amount of time to complete by someone with extensive skills in the relevant areas. Those skills take many years of study and experience to develop - and that will cost you good money upwards of $6,000 unless you do in fact employ the services of a website 'sweat shop'.

I have just had my website re-designed, I am able to update everything myself, it includes an online shopping cart system for purchasing prints and digital downloads for my event photography, a separate section for portrait print purchases (as they are different pricing structure to event photography), and a separate section for purchasing my Photographic Art via Redbubble that is integrated into my website design (as far as I know this is completely unique, but despite its deceptively simple and straightforward appearance it has taken extensive design and programming to achieve).

I've done alot of the work myself under guidance and this has been a massive project with ongoing tweaking to resolve some apparent minor things that are actually complicated programming issues. I have been assured that anyone else requiring a similar thing from scratch would be looking at around $15,000.

Excessive? Absolutely not, if I had done it all myself I'd be charging double that!

So while you may not like the accurate information you received from your 'Phone a friend' I wouldn't be expecting anything different from Eddie either.

[Ford Kristo]

Roo,
I would appreciate the contact details.

Regards
Ford

[Ford Kristo]

Thanks to rellick666, Redgum and mcdesign.

To ricktas: My comment re parasites relates to web site providers that slug you 10% on your sales as well as charging ongoing costs for using the service.
So, we have the situation where you pay for a print and framing and the web site people charge you 10% on your costs as well as your profit. Add the GST and you have a 20% impost on the client. I can't see that this is fair or reasonable.

I have been consistently told by people who have graphics heavy, commercial websites that they paid around $4000 for the work. When I approach the same developer the price is well in excess of $6000 for not a great deal more functionality. In this thread we have a prices of $1000-$5000 "for someone fairly decent", $6000 and $15,000. Confusing???????? I'll say!

I did not, in fact, ever say any of the responses were wrong. Some weren't helpful, and I made comments to that effect. If someone wanted to know what I had been quoted, a simple question would have sufficed.

[mwphoto]

I have been consistently told by people who have graphics heavy, commercial websites that they paid around $4000 for the work. When I approach the same developer the price is well in excess of $6000 for not a great deal more functionality. In this thread we have a prices of $1000-$5000 "for someone fairly decent", $6000 and $15,000. Confusing???????? I'll say!

Its no different or any more confusing than say, finding a wedding photographer - some will charge $500 some will charge $15,000 - they are all providing the same service of photographing a wedding but there are other factors that will influence prices.

If you have been given quotes by companies that are higher than you consider reasonable for little difference to what you know they charged other people for similar websites, then perhaps what you are asking for and consider 'not much more functionality' is far more complex than you think, or you are approaching web designers in a similar manner to how you started this thread and thereby putting them on the defensive?

[kiwi]

Besides, how can you call people in the photographic service business parasites without any obvious idea of commercial reality or business models....it's a small world.

[Ford Kristo]

Well, quite easily.... I typed it in the box.

[mwphoto]

[edk]

* removed : members with under 50 posts and 30 days membership are not allowed to discuss commercial sties : refer to the site rules : admin *

[Erin]

I have been consistently told by people who have graphics heavy, commercial websites that they paid around $4000 for the work. When I approach the same developer the price is well in excess of $6000 for not a great deal more functionality. In this thread we have a prices of $1000-$5000 "for someone fairly decent", $6000 and $15,000. Confusing???????? I'll say!

Let me expand on my comment so it's less confusing. $1000-$5000 for "someone fairly decent" does not equate to "someone who is brilliant and will do everything you want". That's the price that you'd be looking at for a fairly new graduate or mostly inexperienced person or someone who does not make a living off what they do. More experience = more skills = higher cost for time/results. The more popular a designer is, the more time-poor they become, so the price goes up. Perhaps the developers that did your friends' site realised he was under-charging for the amount of work that they were doing and revised their costs accordingly. Perhaps they've expanded their business and now have employees who assist and need to be paid. Business is ever-evolving.

[xkellie]

removed! Site rule breach