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Thread: Advice on buying a P.S

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    Member fairy bombs's Avatar
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    Advice on buying a P.S

    Looking to buy a P.S that is around $300 to $400 that is reasonable.

    I do not like those tiny tiny thin ones,I like the look of the Pentax X90,but it does not have a very long,long exp time 4 seconds,also It does not have RAW.

    I see some of the Minolta P.S get good reports.I would like HD video.

    Yes,I have some good SLR gear and lenses,But sometimes I am on a field trip

    and just do not have room.I have a canon P.S 580 power shot,But I here the PS have gone up in quality since then.Any AP member got a P.S they happy with?

    I hear the Minolta ones could be a bit dearer than $400,are thet worth it?

    Thanks for any advice.

    FB
    Canon 50D and 450D - Canon 10-22 F3.5-5.6, 17-55 F2.8 L, 70-200 F2.8 L, 400 prime F5.6 L, 60mm F2.8 macro, EX 430 Flash,and all sorts of other bits and pieces

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    Quote Originally Posted by fairy bombs View Post
    Looking to buy a P.S that is around $300 to $400 that is reasonable.

    I do not like those tiny tiny thin ones,I like the look of the Pentax X90,but it does not have a very long,long exp time 4 seconds,also It does not have RAW.

    I see some of the Minolta P.S get good reports.I would like HD video.

    Yes,I have some good SLR gear and lenses,But sometimes I am on a field trip

    and just do not have room.I have a canon P.S 580 power shot,But I here the PS have gone up in quality since then.Any AP member got a P.S they happy with?

    I hear the Minolta ones could be a bit dearer than $400,are thet worth it?

    Thanks for any advice.

    FB
    Sorry, I really haven't kept up with P&S cameras. My other camera is this iPhone.



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    Ausphotography Site Sponsor/Advertiser OzzieTraveller's Avatar
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    G'day FB

    You are asking for a camera which will do both long exposures & shoot in Raw as well
    There are very few with both items ticked

    I suggest you look at the Panasonic Lumix FZ35 & FZ100 cameras &/or the Fuji HS-10 - all have what you want

    As well as that, each has many of the dSLR features of P-A-S-M operation, image stabilisation, focussing & metering choices, burst shooting [the FZ35 will shoot at 15fps in one mode], and so it goes on
    Also fwiw - the Lumix has the best electronic viewvinder I have seen in the past year or three - it has some wonderful features that dSLR users simply do not ever get to see

    I also suggest you google 'shopbot' for pricing options
    Hope this helps a bit ...
    Regards, Phil
    Of all the stuff in a busy photographers kitbag, the ability to see photographically is the most important
    google me at Travelling School of Photography
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    Canon S95 would be my pick, though you'll have to flesh out your budget a bit. If you think that is too small, maybe the Canon G12.

    So for $300-400 you expect something new that will take RAW (in a cheap compact of taht range, what's the point???) and long exposures (again, noise??). Not gonna happen. Maybe try to find a G9 canon on the secondhand market or something, though not sure if they did raw that far back
    Canon stuff 5Dmk1 w/ 24-70 f2.8L, Canon 5Dmk1 w/70-200f2.8L, 100mm f2.8 macro, 50mm f1.4, 580exII
    Alienbees B800, Lumopro 160, Manfrotto 155XPROB w/ 498RC2, Lowepro ProRunner X450AW
    Phew!

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    In Training MarkChap's Avatar
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    I had a play in the shop today with some Richo offerings, I was pleasantly surprised, manual control right down to manual focus.
    Wonderful close up/macro offering

    GX200
    CX4
    CX3

    And This can be had a very reasonable price
    R10
    Smoke Alarms Save Lives, Install One Today
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    Cheers, Mark


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    In Training MarkChap's Avatar
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    This is a nice little unit also

    SX210IS

    And the all new, but a little over your $400.00, but a great camera
    SX30IS

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    thanks for all the help,I will check out those Lumix ones.

    But It might just be easy to buy a 7D,and lug it.

    Some of those Lumix a very good but the price is a good portion of a 7d.

    Anyhow thanks again.

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    Member exwintech's Avatar
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    Fairy Bombs - If you're used to DSLRs with viewfinders - you might note that the Canon S90/95 aren't so equipped, but do very nice images.

    The new Canon SX30 - 30x zoom, does have a viewfinder, doesn't do RAW (without a CHDK hack), max-continuous is 1.3fps. Has 14Mpix crowded onto a 1/2.3 CCD - low light not too good - visible noise at ISO 200, more so at 400, ISO 800 "only if you have to". Max ISO, 1600, not very usable. Stills IQ Reviews below Fuji HS10. Does have good 1280 x 720 H264/MOV, with Exposure Control.

    Panasonic FZ100 - 24x zoom, has viewfinder, has RAW, does 11fps / 5fps continuous. 14Mpix on 1/2.3 sensor. Max ISO 1600, some noise at ISO 400, rather more at 800. IQ rated similar to Canon SX20 for JPEGs. Does Std and Full HD video.

    Fuji HS10 (I have one) - 30x zoom. Has viewfinder, has RAW. Does 10/7/5/3fps on JPEG (the 10fps after firmware 1.02 tests at 12+fps), and 5/3fps in RAW, or RAW + JPEG. It has 10Mpix on a 1/2.3 BSI-CMOS sensor.

    Noise is almost nil at 100 ISO, and 200 ISO - Dynamic Range 200% available at ISO 200, DR 400% at ISO 400, and noise is still low at 400. ISO 800 and 1600 are good in low light and indoors, and noise is modest at 800, not very high at 1600. Using RAW and de-noising in PP gives better results than in JPEGs, but the JPEGs are quite usable from 1600 x 1200 down. Images at ISO 3200 and 6400 have more visible noise, but JPEGs are usable from 1280 x 1024 down.

    Again - RAW and some gentle de-noise in PP is better. However, I have quite usable JPEG images at 1024 x 768 - at 3200 and 6400 with full optical 30x zoom - and at "virtual 60x" - 1,440mm - with the integrated 2x digital zoom.

    One test image on a cloudy dull day shows house wall bricks, range 70-80 metres, clearly at ISO 6400 and 2x digital zoom / 1,440mm virtual. I have a 100% Photoshop crop - showing the cracks in 1 brick quite clearly.

    So the HS10's high ISO and integrated 2x-digital are very usable, even in combination.

    However, the HS10, which has about a dozen external buttons and dials, is quite challenging to learn, though would be no worries to a DSLR user. It's a camera that "has to be told what to do" - and then the Fujinon lens and BSI-CMOS sensor work well together.

    I can post the 3200 / 6400 ISO images with and without 2x / 60x digital, if you wish.

    Dave.
    Last edited by exwintech; 24-10-2010 at 10:31am.

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    Thanks Dave.

    This FZ 100 keeps coming up,what does one cost?

    I do not like using a camera without a view finder,so they are out!

    If anyone here uses a FZ 100,let me know what you think,and any sample images would be great.

    The Fuji HS 10,I am totally unfamilar with,but sounds good Dave.

    I will goole it to see what it looks like,what sort of price are they Dave?

    Thanks for help. FB

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    Way Down Yonder in the Paw Paw Patch jim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scotty72 View Post
    Sorry, I really haven't kept up with P&S cameras. My other camera is this iPhone.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Something like this. A decent phone camera is a pretty good supplement to an SLR, having exactly the opposite set of virtues. A dedicated P&S now seems to fall between two stools.
    All constructive criticism accepted with gratitude.


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    Member exwintech's Avatar
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    Fairy Bombs - The DCW, Sydney, price on the HS10 is $505.00.

    Re the EVF/LCD - early Reviews and Owner Reports said they were "Dreadful, dim and grainy..." That actually quite accurately describes Fuji's factory-default settings. Change the 30fps to 60fps - and Brightness up - I use +3, but there are 11 levels, including the default "0". It's then very adequate.

    The device has an "Automatic Sensor" that switches between EVF and LCD. It is very sensitive. Even the shadow of a hand or camera strap will "flip" it. It also runs all the time, using power... Before letting it drive you daft - switch it off. There's a thumb-handy manual switch at the lower left of the EVF. Turning it off more than compensates for running the EVF/LCD at 60fps. I get 400-450 shots on a set of 4 AA Eneloops, without video.

    I wear glasses for most things (into my doddering-era at 62) - but the diopter adjuster beside the EVF has enough adjustment to let me use it without glasses.

    Turn off the 1.5/3.0 seconds "Review" feature - for faster tme between shots. You can instantly check last shots with the button bottom-right of the camera.

    If you look at the "PhotographyBlog" Site - they have large clear all-angles shots of the camera at the beginning of the Review.

    Here's a couple of samples - all at 60-70 metres, sunny day.

    1 - 30x optical
    2 - 30x + 20% digital, 'virtual 36x" - similar to Canon SX30 35x zoom
    3 - 30x optical, + 2x digital - for "virtual 60x"

    Those are "Fine" JPEGs, not RAWs, so not processed.

    Can post samples, dull day, ISO 3200 and 6400, with ISO 6400 + 2x digital "virtual 60x" - with a 100% PS crop for detail, if desired.

    Dave.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by exwintech; 24-10-2010 at 3:11pm.

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    Ausphotography Site Sponsor/Advertiser OzzieTraveller's Avatar
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    G'day Dave - et al

    Nice to read such positive comments about the Fuji
    All too often, these cameras get overlooked by the media in their rush to 'promote' the latest dSLR ~ and as a user of such items, I know how great they can be
    Well done

    Regards, Phil

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    Hi Fairy Bombs
    Before you ditch the Canon A580 have a look here,
    http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/CHDK
    You can transform it into anything you want
    Col

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    I have the FZ35, it is great, shoots RAW, does long exposures. It's only drawback is it is not so good at anything ov er 100 ISO speed - grain/noise starts to show.

    A link to long exposure on 200ISo to show what I mean
    Odille

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    My Blog | Canon 1DsMkII | 60D | Tokina 20-35mm f/2.8 AF AT-X PRO | EF50mm f/1.8| Sigma 150-500mm F5-6.3 APO DG OS HSM | Fujifilm X-T1 & X-M1 | Fujinon XC 16-50mm F3.5-5.6 OIS | Fujinon XC 50-230mm F3.5-5.6 OIS | Fujinon XF 18-55mm F2.8-4R LM OIS | tripods, flashes, filters etc ||

  15. #15
    Member exwintech's Avatar
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    Phil - Yes, indeed - but the HS10 "falls down" for the folk - and sadly includes some Reviewers - who prefer to use Auto for snaps... The HS10 will do "images" in Auto - but for using mainly Auto - there are plenty of lower-cost P&S cameras which do that better. It does a bit better in Program - but lock it out of the "Auto" ISO 100-400 and 100-800 ranges.

    For best results - including JPEGs - you have to tell it what to do. On high zoom and/or dull days - the AF will "hunt" like a Foxie on Steroids...! Change to the fast and good MF to "tell it about that", too.

    For a high-zoom Bridge Camera - that does quite nicely on Auto and Program - the Canon SX30 will be preferred by many. They might not notice that the JPEGs (over $500.00 and no RAW?) - aren't nearly as good as the Canon SX10's Superfines. Or that 'noise' begins at ISO 200, heavier at ISO 400 - and by 800, it's "only if you had to". Max Continuous is slower than the SX10, even, at 1.3fps.... It's a bit difficult not to notice that. But it does Video very well - so it should be very popular.


    Analog6 - You might then give Fuji's HS10 a look. It has 4-sec to 1/4000th in most modes, and 30-sec to 1/4000th in Manual - no "Bulb" mode, though.

    Fuji stuck with 10Mpix on the new BSI-CMOS 1/2.3 sensor - not crowding 12 or even 14 Mpix onto the same size sensor. Placing the receptors' electronic connectors on the back of the sensor (the Back Side Illuminated /BSI thing) - allows the receptors to be larger and slightly further apart. This makes the HS10 good in low light, and at high ISOs.

    There's almost nil noise at ISO 100 and 200 - you can use 200 as a general mode, and that also allows you to enable the enhanced Dynamic Range 200%. Noise is still low at ISO 400 - and you can use DR-400% with that. ISO 800 and 1600 are quite okay for dull days, deep shade, and indoors. For A4 sized "printables" at 800 and 1600 - use RAW and some de-noising. Or the JPEGs are quite good at 1600 x 1200 and below, for onscreen or sharing.

    You can do "usable onscreen" 30x JPEGs at ISO 3200 and 6400 - including when using the 2x integrated zoom...

    Very dull day examples at 60-70 metres, are:

    1 - 30x optical - ISO 6400
    2 - 30x optical + 2x digital = virtual 60x - ISO 6400
    3 - 100% Photoshop crop of "2" - showing that 'some' detail is retained. (It's the brick at top-centre of "2")

    The focus was on the wall, not the tree.

    Dave.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by exwintech; 25-10-2010 at 8:02am.

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