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Thread: 50D and Noise suppression

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    The Commander mikew09's Avatar
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    50D and Noise suppression

    I have seen noise discussed quite a bit when i was researching my next purchase, now the 50D. Didn't really experience the issue until I took a photo at a horse event at iso 200 and later seen quite a lot of noise on the face heavily shade by her hat. Mind I have only just got the 50D and still in learning mode. I have to admit that my 400D was much more forgiving. I have taken a number of other shots at lower and higher iso and definately is not as bad. Did some looking, again; on the web and came across a thread that turning off the Auto Light Optimiser (ALO) feature has a big impact on reducing the noise in shadow issue.

    When I did a search on ALO there was a bit of a following to the same. Hence I have turned off the ALO feature but yet to test.
    Luv the 50D and to date this is the only one thing I can fault with it but in favour of the camera, I am still to learn correct usage coming from my 400d.
    Interested to hear thoughts comments from other 50D owners.

    Mike
    Please be honest with your Critique of my images. I may not always agree, but I will not be offended - CC assists my learning and is always appreciated

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    I only shoot raw so can't comment on the ALO feature. All I can say is it has a little less noise than my Pentax k7 did, but fairly close..

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    Ausphotography Veteran yummymummy's Avatar
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    yeah mine's fairly noisy on the darker parts of a photo too .. still not as bad as the 1000D though lol so I'm not worried!
    Happy to take all constructive Critique, please don't rework or edit my photos. Thanks!

    Canon 6D, 2 Canon 50D's gripped, Canon 1000D, Canon 70-200 F2.8 ( non IS),Canon 70-200 2.8, Canon 24-70 2.8, Sigma 85 1.4, Canon 50mm F1.8.. yongnuo speedlights and triggers, and manfrotto tripods.


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    Quote Originally Posted by joele View Post
    I only shoot raw so can't comment on the ALO feature. All I can say is it has a little less noise than my Pentax k7 did, but fairly close..
    hmmm, that is interesting to hear, thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by yummymummy View Post
    yeah mine's fairly noisy on the darker parts of a photo too .. still not as bad as the 1000D though lol so I'm not worried!
    Hmmmm, it was pretty bad in these shots, worse than my 400D which did cocern me a little. Odd thing is, can't say I have noticed it on other shots on the same day. Will see how it goes before I get cocerned. I have used higher iso and no problem but I did rad that the ALO was a problem at the low ISO end. When I test will post observations

    Thanks Kirsty

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikew09 View Post
    I have seen noise discussed quite a bit when i was researching my next purchase, now the 50D. Didn't really experience the issue until I took a photo at a horse event at iso 200 and later seen quite a lot of noise on the face heavily shade by her hat. Mind I have only just got the 50D and still in learning mode. I have to admit that my 400D was much more forgiving. I have taken a number of other shots at lower and higher iso and definately is not as bad. Did some looking, again; on the web and came across a thread that turning off the Auto Light Optimiser (ALO) feature has a big impact on reducing the noise in shadow issue.

    When I did a search on ALO there was a bit of a following to the same. Hence I have turned off the ALO feature but yet to test.
    Luv the 50D and to date this is the only one thing I can fault with it but in favour of the camera, I am still to learn correct usage coming from my 400d.
    Interested to hear thoughts comments from other 50D owners.

    Mike
    G'day Mike,
    Your 400D and 50D both have almost the exact sensor size: 22.2 X 14.8mm for the 400D and 22.3 X 14.9mm for the 50D.
    With almost no change in sensor size, and in order for Canon to cram 15.1 megapixels into a sensor previously happy with 10.1 megapixels, they had to reduce the size of each pixel.
    The 400D had bigger pixels! 5.7µm in size while the 50D had smaller: 4.7 µm
    The bigger pixels have more light gathering characteristics and low light behaviour than smaller pixels. This is the reason for noise creeping into higher pixel count cameras without increasing their sensor size. Note that even Canon has come (silently) into reducing megapixels on their new camera line up! (different story, altogether...)
    Cheers and all the best!

    ps...
    I just got informed Canon has a lower MPixel Full Frame camera in the works... 10 Aug 2010
    (Nikon was right all along, not jumping into the MPixel race...)
    Last edited by RaoulIsidro; 10-08-2010 at 12:03pm.
    "The greatest camera in the world is the one you hold in your hands when shit happens." ©2007 Raoul Isidro

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    Quote Originally Posted by RaoulIsidro View Post
    G'day Mike,
    Your 400D and 50D both have almost the exact sensor size: 22.2 X 14.8mm for the 400D and 22.3 X 14.9mm for the 50D.
    With almost no change in sensor size, and in order for Canon to cram 15.1 megapixels into a sensor previously happy with 10.1 megapixels, they had to reduce the size of each pixel.
    The 400D had bigger pixels! 5.7µm in size while the 50D had smaller: 4.7 µm
    The bigger pixels have more light gathering characteristics and low light behaviour than smaller pixels. This is the reason for noise creeping into higher pixel count cameras without increasing their sensor size. Note that even Canon has come (silently) into reducing megapixels on their new camera line up! (different story, altogether...)
    Cheers and all the best!

    ps...
    I just got informed Canon has a lower MPixel Full Frame camera in the works... 10 Aug 2010
    (Nikon was right all along, not jumping into the MPixel race...)
    Thanks for the exclaimation-makes sense with what else I have read. I have found quite a bit different using the 50D and no doubt quite a bit of learning to be done.

    So, I assume that the ALO introduces noise as it attempts to lighten those darker areas on the operators behalf. I will still leave it disabled as that is a choice I would rather cosider mysef.

    Thanks again. :-)

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    Will be interesting to see what happens regarding pixel counts, If the rumours are true the 60d will have the 18mp sensor from the 7d/550d (fair enough) and the next Nikon D90 will have a Sony 16mp sensor (also makes sense from what we have seen from Sony).. The pixel count wars may not be over yet, though really at 15mp I am happy for it to stop, but I doubt it..

    One thing I do notice when comparing say the 30d or 40d to the 50d, at 100% on the screen the 50d looks noisier at higher ISOs, but if you resize the 50d image down to the size of the 40d or 30d images it is at least as good. Same for printing at like sizes..
    Last edited by joele; 10-08-2010 at 7:11pm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joele View Post
    One thing I do notice when comparing say the 30d or 40d to the 50d, at 100% on the screen the 50d looks noisier at higher ISOs, but if you resize the 50d image down to the size of the 40d or 30d images it is at least as good. Same for printing at like sizes..
    Here is a comparison of pixel sizes of the models you mentioned:

    50D 4.7 µm
    40D 5.7 µm
    30D 6.4 µm

    Note that the 5DMk2 has a pixel size of 6.4 µm!

    Also, the reason why the classic 5D is so good in low light: 8.2 µm!
    Cheers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by joele View Post
    Will be interesting to see what happens regarding pixel counts, If the rumours are true the 60d will have the 18mp sensor from the 7d/550d (fair enough) and the next Nikon D90 will have a Sony 16mp sensor (also makes sense from what we have seen from Sony).. The pixel count wars may not be over yet, though really at 15mp I am happy for it to stop, but I doubt it..

    One thing I do notice when comparing say the 30d or 40d to the 50d, at 100% on the screen the 50d looks noisier at higher ISOs, but if you resize the 50d image down to the size of the 40d or 30d images it is at least as good. Same for printing at like sizes..
    So that is interesting - are you saying if you reduce the file size of the raw image in camera you will actually get a better qulity photo with less noice for the same shot?

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    No as that just throws away pixels I think.. I just mean take a shot with each and then reduce the size of the 50d image to match the resolution of the earlier camera.. rather than compare the differently sized images at 100%

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    Quote Originally Posted by joele View Post
    No as that just throws away pixels I think.. I just mean take a shot with each and then reduce the size of the 50d image to match the resolution of the earlier camera.. rather than compare the differently sized images at 100%
    Great, thanks for clarifying. Interesting topic really. Was hoping to do the ALO & no ALO comparisions today but the constant rain has put an end to that - not that I am complaining, we really need the rain.

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    Ausphotography Regular Tricky's Avatar
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    There may be more noise with the 50D, but you've also got higher resolution to play with... apply a light noise reduction filter and the end result should be better than the 400D... I know that's another step in your workflow, but pretty much unavoidable with high MP crop cameras these days...
    Richard
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