Wedding prices?

[mpot]

The first few weddings I did, there was no money involved, I simply asked my friends if they would sign a release form so i could use their images to show prospective clients in the future.

Actually, you don't need a release form for that.

You only need a release form in Australia if you are using the photos for commercial use - where "commercial use does not mean the sale a picture, but rather the use of a person's likeness to endorse some product or service, or to entice others to buy it."
(from here)

[kiwi]

you might also be aware that copyright of wedding photos remains with the couple unless you chnage this in a contract

[campo]

Actually, you don't need a release form for that.

I think you misread

"to show prospective clients in the future" was my way of saying I'll be using those pictures to advertise my business/services. See the next point on the link you provided:

"A wedding photographer shows samples of their work on their website. Commercial — they are using images of people to endorse or sell their wedding photography services."

My "release form" also deals with copyright too :-)

[Zac]

you might also be aware that copyright of wedding photos remains with the couple unless you chnage this in a contract

Nope. Copyright belongs to the photographer unless specified in a contract HOWEVER you should always have a model release for any images you intend to exhibit as there is a lot more to the law than just copyright...

[kiwi]

Zac, nooo, check the Australian copyright council's fact sheet g11

If you are commissioned to take a photo of someone they own copyright

Not sure if this applies to free, I'd imagine it needs some consideration to occur

[Zac]

Zac, nooo, check the Australian copyright council's fact sheet g11

If you are commissioned to take a photo of someone they own copyright

Not sure if this applies to free, I'd imagine it needs some consideration to occur

Thanks, its more complex than I remember. For a free (TFCD) shoot my understanding is that the photographer owns copyright, but its good to cover usage rights in your model release to prevent misunderstandings. e.g. the model may display the photographs but may not sell them, or modify them in any way. The rules for "commissioned" work only apply if the client pays the photographer.

For commissioned work, you simply make sure that wording giving the photographer copyright is included in your contract :-)

These are the relevant parts of the G10 document here:
http://www.copyright.org.au/pdf/acc/...s_pdf/g011.pdf

Who owns copyright?
For photographs, unless there is an agreement to the contrary, the general rule is that the photographer is the first owner of copyright. (Note that you will not own copyright just because you own the camera).

There are, however, a number of exceptions to this general rule, set out in the following paragraphs.

If more than one person is involved in the creation of copyright material, or the material is created under an agreement or by commission, it is a good idea to have a written agreement stating who will own copyright.

Note that in many cases a person who is not the copyright owner will have rights to use the photographs in various ways (for example, as a result of an express or implied licence).

Commissioned photographs
Specific provisions set out the general rules on ownership of copyright where a person who is not the photographer’s employer (a client) pays a photographer to take a photograph.

For photographs taken on or after 30 July 1998, the general rule on ownership depends on the purpose for which the photographs were taken:
• if the photographs were taken for “private or domestic purposes” (such as family portraits, or wedding photographs), the first owner of copyright in them is the client, unless the photographer and client agree otherwise; however
• if they were taken for any other purpose (e.g. commercial shots), the photographer will be the first owner of copyright, unless the photographer and client agree otherwise.
If someone owns copyright in a photograph as a result of having commissioned it (without having reached any other agreement about ownership), the photographer has the right to restrain the use of the photograph for purposes other than those for which it was commissioned (provided these purposes were made known at the time of the arrangement). This rule applies to any photograph taken on or after 1 May 1969. Even though the client
is the owner of copyright, the photographer can rely on his/her right of restraint to negotiate further payment for uses that were not contemplated at the outset.

Not relevant to the OP but for the sake of completeness :

Photographs taken in the course of employment
If an employee takes a photograph as part of his or her job, the first owner of copyright will be the employer, unless they have made an agreement to the contrary. This general rule is subject to two major exceptions, set out in the following paragraphs.

Photographs taken by employees of newspaper and magazine publishers
For photographs taken on or after 30 July 1998, the photographer owns the rights to photocopy the photographs and include them in books; the publisher owns all other rights.
These rules do not apply to freelance photographers, who are covered by the general rule that the person who takes the photograph owns copyright in it (unless they make an agreement to the contrary).

Photographs taken for the government
Unless there is an agreement to the contrary, a Commonwealth, State or Territory government is the first owner of copyright in material created, or first published, under its direction or control. Note that these provisions do not apply to local governments. For more information, see our information sheet Governments (Commonwealth, State and Territory).

[Ed Downunder]

WOW a lot of good advice here.

If your interest is more wedding's and a future in weddings then you need to consider some of the comments about free & second shooter. You really do need an environment where you can feel the pressure but not the responsibility. The gear is not the primary issue but knowing what you can achieve is. I went to a rehersal and shot a few to get an idea for the big day. I had some really interesting stuff lined up. On the day it was later in the day and overcast. Turned out a bit of a disaster. To much excitment and animation to shoot in low light with a slow lens

canon 5d mk2 24 105 F4.0 L IS lens didn't cope. I needed to switch over to 70 - 200 F2.5 IS. (not in my bag and still on my wish list) and that was only one problem.

My second wedding was much better. I turned up with my gear I mingled kept out of the way moved forward when appropriate and earned a reputation that my pics were better than the pro (not true of course but my shots were there and the pressure was also there but not the resposibility. I still wanted to switch over to the 70 200 that is still on the wish list).

The big lesson here for me was to know the limitations of my gear and of myself.

I will do more in future and will look for opportunities to develop my skills. Best of luck to you.

[Longshots]

Actually, you don't need a release form for that.

You only need a release form in Australia if you are using the photos for commercial use - where "commercial use does not mean the sale a picture, but rather the use of a person's likeness to endorse some product or service, or to entice others to buy it."
(from here)

Sorry but I must correct you. Although this may be slightly off topic of the OP's question, I find this type of advice slightly dangerous. This is often stated and is completely wrong. As a one involved in the business side of photography for a great number of years, and in specifics, almost obsessive with the details, this is 100% wrong. Please check and recheck the bio on the author of the website, you're quoting from. Quite simply, he's wrong.

If you want the correct information refer to Australian Copyright Council, and read the Australian Copyright Act.

[Longshots]

I have never done any wedding photography before. But I have been asked to do my friends wedding next July.

I was wondering if anyone could help me out with pricing.
Is there a rough hourly rate that I should use?

Or is there any other tips anyone can give me on pricing.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Some very good advice from others. My first question is just because you have been asked, why do you think it would be ok to then charge ? As you wont have any business foundations, ie insurance or anything like that; why make it more complicated ?

I'd seriously take the advice of dont do it, unless you have supreme confidence. How many weddings have you attended ? Looking at how others have their weddings shot, can give you some great help. I'd try and get myself invited to as many as possible, and also see if you can get some work experience with a wedding photographer.

All of that would be first on my to do list

[wattsgallery]

-

I first started off with doing 2nd shooter gigs and getting as much experience as possible. Its the only way to start and learn.


Best of luck.

Some good advice in the thread although (from my novice perspective) I think if you pitch it correctly, set the right expectations and get some experience beforehand you should give it a go. I just shot my cousins wedding - made plenty of mistakes and learnt a lot - but ultimately there are more good shots than they had hoped (+200 keepers of day and +25 they want to blow up).

I am shocked by how little some of you guys charge given the work involved (Sidd checked out your site nice work and cheap packages). I spent many hours preparing and checking out venue and talking to the couple, obviously a full day shooting and many nights processing images. I was doing it for free but probably would charge if I did it again given the amount of work and stress involved.

One way as mentioned to avoid the charging = professional service perception is to have a fee based on some reasonable costs. That might include gear hire, travel, a wedding workshop you attend, books, software (Lightroom), cf cards etc. These add up and if you list them as the cost they can see that it is money you incur in taking on the role not as a 'profit'. You should line up a second shooter as well as a fallback.

Just my view. Good luck.

[AutumnCurl]

I come across this thread and i think the wedding photos turned out fine