Nikon 80 - 400

[NickoHG]

Hi Kiwi

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/re...ssage=31024609

Check out this link of users.

As far as I am concerned I'm sure it will do the job for me
Noel

[MarkW]

Nicko
Just remember that what you are reading there on DP is no better or worse than what you read here. The opinions are generally those of amateures with a few professionals thrown in. Generally the pro's won't have that lens so their comments hold little relevance and the amateures who actually have the lens may be insufficiently skilled to recognise good from bad or where a problem really exists. For example one respondant complained about the vibration even in MLU. This is a result of partially the lens leg and more his choice of tripod and head. There are aftermarket legs for this lens which will improve this situation. Many of the respondants ranted on about how the VR system needed an update. This lens should really be used with some sort of support, ie a tripod, a monopod or even a beanbag. Its not the weight or physical length of the lens, its what your doing with it. Your shooting at a long distance, so you need support.

After spending twenty minutes working through a sine rule calc, if the end of your lens at full extension (which is aout 400mm from the sensor) moves 0.1mm then at your subject some 40 metres away you will have a deflection of 3.046mm. This is enough to totally ruin your image as that much movement cant be removed using photoshop. A tenth of a millimetre is a very small movement at your end.

The 80-400 is only a relatively small lens when compared to its prime lens cousins. You would never consider hand holding a 400 prime for too long and especially when shoot at a distance. Birds in flight are an anomoly, you cant tripod your lens as you just cant move quick enough to maintain lock on the bird - its a specialist skill and a slightly out of focus BIF is acceptable where as a static subject even at 40 metres should be in focus.

[NickoHG]

MarkW
Yes one has to take such comments with a grain of salt, and no matter what lens is reviewed there are varying comments made. I have read that the collar needs replacing to steady the lens and even that it just requires tightening well, I suppose I will find out when I purchase the lens. Others suggested using a monopod with VR and it works perfectly?

Anyway I ready appreciated your comments and now it is up to me.
Nicko

[MarkW]

Just so you know before hand, you cant tighten the lens collar to remove the vibration issue, its caused by the design of the collar leg which needs a webbing in the casting. Making it thicker would help but to be engineered correctly the use of a web element allong the front edge would remove the compressive bend.

The alternative is to replace the collar and leg assembly. Kirk make one - see here http://www.kirkphoto.com/Lens_Collar....5-5.6_VR.html

This will remove the vibration from the lens movement.

[NickoHG]

Thanks MarkW

I had read about this collar so thanks again for the link.

Are they available in Australia or just from Kirk?

NickoHG

[MarkW]

There are a couple of these sorts of companies but unfortunately they are all overseas and don't have Australian agents. This sort of gear is generally for the very dedicated or pro photographer and mostly catering to wildlife and nature. As they cater for such a small niche market you find that the prices are very high and then coming mostly from the US, you have to factor in exchange rates, shipping, insurance and whether you go over the magic $1000 AUD which means your subject to GST and Customs fees. All of these can add up to a very hefty cost for something relatively insignificant.

The ones I use are:

Kirks - http://www.kirkphoto.com/

Really Right Stuff - http://reallyrightstuff.com/index.html

Wimberley - http://www.tripodhead.com/index.cfm

The secret behind all of these companies is the interchangability across the the quick release tripod plate, called an "arca-swiss" type plate. Once you set your system up using this type of QR plate, you open yourself up to a marvel range of systems for flash head, lens mounts, tripod systems and the list goes on.

Good luck holding onto your credit card - this world aint cheap

[TommySix]

Apparently the new 2x tc works like magic particularly on the 70-200


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Got any links to comparisons? I'm intrigued..!

Now if only I can find a used 70-200 VR1 somewhere

[NickoHG]

Hi MarkW
So if I go down the path of Kirk lens collar does that mean I will require another plate to fit to my tripod/monopod?

[MarkW]

Yes

Everthing works around the acra swiss QR plates which replace the QR plate on your support systems.

See here http://www.kirkphoto.com/Universal-Q...se-Clamps.html

[NickoHG]

Oh dear, that means my favorite Manfrotto pistol grip may have to move on. Any way I will wait until the lens collar arrives and see what the go is.
Thanks again MarkW for your support.
NickoHG

[MarkW]

Pistol grips are reknown for bad support due to the distace the camera is from the ball mechanism. This distance acts as a leverage point (3rd order of levers) so that a minor movement or vibration is amplified - a horrible situation for a long lens.

[NickoHG]

Hi MarkW
I'm surprised with that, the Manfrotto 322RC2 HEAVY DUTY GRIP BALL HEAD does not seem to have any vibration and seems to lock really tight. However I am inexperienced with more serious photography so one learns.

What is your option between the Nikon 14-24mm f/2.8G ED, 16-35mm f/4G ED VR Lens, 17-35mm f/2.8D IF-ED, 17-55mm f/2.8G ED-IF AF-S DX Zoom ?

NickoHG

[MarkW]

Having looked at your model ball head its not the model I was taking about - the model I thought you had was the 222 Joystick head which has the release mechanism between the QR plate and the actual ball assembly.


Which as you can see is a stupid way to support a camera - any movement at the ball or the connection to ball is amplified along the support shaft.

As for the lenses - I don't use DX, never have but that is a hangover from my days with 35mm film. Sensor sizes were always going to get bigger to match the old 35mm frame. My hope is they never produce an FX2 sensor size but then all my lenses are today futureproofed as best as possible.

So we have discounted the 17-55

The rest of the lenses are landscape lenses or at least that is what I presume you want to do with them.

The 17-35 I own and have had for a few years now - a very good lens, no VR which is a shame for a walk around but for a tripod mount its hard to beat. Watch out for barrel distortion below 20 but then who cares about BD when shooting landscapes.

The 14-24 doesn't have screw on front filters and for a landscape lens that truely is unacceptable, how am I to fit a CPL or a grad?. I think Lee came up with a solution but that was big bulky heavy and just not good enough. Anyway once your down below 20 barrel distortion does start to play havoc. Maybe this lens could be used for real estate photos or something similar but for holidays no thanks.

The 16-35 - This is a very new lens and from the early accounts is supposedly pretty good, but then the reviews have only been done by DPR or the like. Its f4 which is really pretty slow and around the same price as the 17-35. With the 17-35 you get f2.8 constant, with the 16-35 you get VRII - choose your poison but I don't think VR is that big. As for the lens reviews, for me I would prefer wait until until Hogan or Rorslett had reviewed the lens rather than to all accounts a bunch of amateurs.

I'm assuming you don't have all these lenses to choose which to take so I will add one to the mix, the 24-70. Ok it doesn't come with VR again a shame, but this lens is rasor sharp over the full range, constant f2.8, internal focus AF-S and really to me just right for a walk around scenery/landscape lens. At 24mm there is no BD and it works wonders on the FX.

[NickoHG]

Hi Mark, wonderful thanks.

The D200 is DX?

Yes I'm looking for a really good landscape lens hence the 17 53 2.8.

When I purchased my D300 I nearly added the 24 70 2.8 yet cost killed me hence the 18 200 I have got. After a year or so it time to add more quality lens.

Anyway decision time.
Noel

[MarkW]

Noel

ATM all Nikons except the D3 and variants and the D700 are DX.

When it comes to lenses I alway buy the best I can get and if that means waiting a couple of months or even a year then so be it. I once bought a Tamron and it was crap, it actually moved backward to focus compared to Nikon - this was the 1980s and times have changed but my resolution to never buy 3rd party has not. There are lots of people who say how good this or that lens is, mostly they're not protogs, they haven't tested a number of that lens, nor equivalent lens from other manufacturers - how can they justify their comments.

With the 17-35 there are plenty of write ups and not everybody liked it as much as I do but every lens in the market seems to have one or two issues as I mentioned in my last post but look here at the lens review by Rorslett http://www.naturfotograf.com/index2.html

and by Thom Hogan http://www.bythom.com/1735lens.htm

These are the people who I trust to give an accurate un-biased review. They have and do call a spade a spade.

Hogan gives it a drawback on the price but this was when it was more than $2.5K cost price. These days it can be had for less than $2k grey market - see here http://www.d-d-photographics.com.au/nikonslracc.htm

In the end you have to buy whats right for you - best wishes

[kiwi]

Mark's right when it comes to waiting for a great lens. What you shouldnt do though is give up/miss all the shots and experience in the meanwhile that you could get with a 3rd party lens

Never an easy call

With landscape lenses, sometimes primes like the 20 2.8 present tremendous value in comparison

[Gregg Bell]

I tried out a 80-400mm for the day, the optics in it are very nice. The motor in it, was good enough for me personally, but It does take time sometimes, it was pretty good, however I was quite happy with the 80-200mm motor, so maybe take mine with a grain of salt?

End of the day I just care about optics, and as long as its motor is faster then the the 18-55mm DX.

[NickoHG]

Hey Mark
Good glass is obviously the best way to go, I have gone ahead with the 80 400, should arrive next week. I find D D Photo has the best prices for most lens, pretty good to deal with as well.

What do you know about 135mm f2 defocus lens?

NickoHG

[NickoHG]

Hi Kiwi
Yes the 20mm is good value however with the D300 it become 30mm, not so good as wide angle which is what I'm after.

Actually damn confusing.
NickHG

[NickoHG]

Gregg
So how was the result compered with the 300 F4?
NickoHG