eBay Experience

[Redgum]

Same thing happened to me. bought a battery from H.K, just needed a cheap one to test an old camera. Never receieved it. Just opened a paypal dispute and got my $4 back the next day.

An important point here. As a prolific user of batteries I find it much simpler and just as inexpensive to buy batteries locally though on-line dealers in Oz. They get to you quickly and you have a telephone number to follow up if necessary. Of course, you still have the possibility of loss in the mail.
The important point is "what items to import". Many of the bigger HK trading companies have established on-shore warehouses in Oz and although GST plays a part in the cost it only represents 1/11th of the price. Often they sell things like batteries from local sources at the same price as their HK outlet.
I only buy small items from overseas when they're not available here.

[fabian628]

i personally believe it was never posted. Just got lost inbetween shippments of larger lots etc. I can imagine it happening occationallyewhen you sell 100's of items a day. I have trouble making sure i send the right item to the right person when i sell 5 things in a week

[Blueywa]

"Old Dog" mentioned this a while back;
He said "I`ve bought a few lenses and neck strap, ext tubes etc and all has gone smoothly. A couple of weeks ago there was a D300 (new) offered close to home. I asked to see it and was basically refused. Could have had it for $900, brand new, so the person said. But it had to be shipped....why I said....I declined to proceed any further. Just this week, similar add, in the next suburb. What a coincidence......beware".

I had a similar thing happen recently when there was an offer for a 'Brand new' Nikon D700 (FX) for a really fantastic price - dont know what it was but something spooked me, I reported it to flea bay and the offer disapeared within minutes.

I generally buy small bits and pieces from sellers with 99% plus ratings and always pay via Paypal.
A couple of occasions I've bought larger items but only from within Australia and still 99% plus sellers.
I had a chinese company do an instant refund when a 'cheap' item hadnt arrived thanks to HK mail.

[KaraT]

I have used ebay a fair few times to both buy and sell items. When selling most items i have sold as 'pick up only' and have never really had any problems with anyone. Recently bought a canon 50mm f1.4 lens from overseas and it arrived within a week and a half which i was really happy with. Have never had any problems buying from stores...

[4wdexposure]

I've been using eBay for several years and have only ever had one problem where the sale was a fraud on a $1,000 lens that I bought and paid for. PayPal refunded my money in 11 days. I've bought/sold over $20,000 of goods - mainly cameras and lenses and tell everyone eBay is the photogrpaher's friend. Admittedly you need to be careful of not paying more than new price in an auction, but apart from that I reckon it's great, But what ever you do (regardless of the incentive the sellers offer for a bank transfer) only use PayPal.*removed, members with under 30 days membership and 50 posts cannot discuss commercial companies - read the site rules * Good camera gear is expensive and if I can get those sort of savings it's another lens I can buy.

[Nikkie]

I like ebay I brought my camera there but since I did I have seen about grey I would not buy another one on ebay just for that reason I don't think mine is grey I don't think I would really know but it has been on the back of my mind just a tad wondering to know for sure I am happy with it and the more I learn esp learning to use Manual and try to keep away from auto a bit more since coming to forum I have been happy with the camera no probs

[I @ M]

I like ebay I brought my camera there but since I did I have seen about grey I would not buy another one on ebay just for that reason I don't think mine is grey

A very quick summary.

#1. If bought from e$ay the likelihood of it being a grey market item is almost 100%

#2. If bought from e$ay and it didn't come from an authorised ( insert camera brand here ) Australia dealer it is a grey market item.

[ricktas]

I like ebay I brought my camera there but since I did I have seen about grey I would not buy another one on ebay just for that reason I don't think mine is grey I don't think I would really know but it has been on the back of my mind just a tad wondering to know for sure I am happy with it and the more I learn esp learning to use Manual and try to keep away from auto a bit more since coming to forum I have been happy with the camera no probs

You can find out if it is grey, get the serial number and contact company (Canon/Nikon etc) here in Australia. Tell them the model and serial number and they can tell you if it was distributed via the 'official' channels, or if it is a grey import.

[Redgum]

I like ebay I brought my camera there but since I did I have seen about grey I would not buy another one on ebay just for that reason I don't think mine is grey I don't think I would really know but it has been on the back of my mind just a tad wondering to know for sure I am happy with it and the more I learn esp learning to use Manual and try to keep away from auto a bit more since coming to forum I have been happy with the camera no probs

Enjoy your camera without fear. It was manufactured in exactly the same place as every other camera of the same brand and the only difference is the vendor it was bought from. In fact, four times as many cameras are sold on the so called grey market as through regular shops which puts you with the majority.

[fabian628]

many people by second hand cameras for very close to hong kong prices becuase I think there is some fear these cameras are fake. You also do not know if someone has bought one from HK and is now selling it used (unless they have a aus invoice)


Enjoy your camera without fear. It was manufactured in exactly the same place as every other camera of the same brand and the only difference is the vendor it was bought from. In fact, four times as many cameras are sold on the so called grey market as through regular shops which puts you with the majority.

+1
The only problem with grey market is how your warranty is handled. If you have to send it overseas for repair / replacement it can be a hassle. Some grey importers have their own shop warranty. If something goes wrong you have at least some leg to stand on unlike a second hand one which is out of warranty. With canon Australia products you will deal with people in Australia, whether you get better service / treatment is debateable

[Nikkie]

Its still heads up for other people to be aware of my cam still works good as far as I can tell I am very happy with and don't feel cheated what so ever but next time I will go more out of my way and make sure I get it from an appropriate place like fabian said warranty reason might be a hassle and thanks for all this good information

[I @ M]

Nikkie, there is nothing to suggest that a grey market ( overseas into Australia ) camera body bought from a reputable vendor has any higher risk of failure than the same product bought from an authorised Australian dealer.
There have been instances where some less than reputable camera sales people have misleadingly sold refurbished ( warranty return and repaired ) camera bodies as "new" through places like e$ay.

There may be other differences in the way the camera is packaged for different markets.

# Some models have been supplied with battery chargers that are intended to work purely with 110 volts instead of 240 volts. Most have a charger that works over the full (universal) voltage range but will still need an adapter to use in Australian power points.

#Many have arrived with a photocopied English user manual although once again many models come with a manual in multi languages.

#Some bodies have arrived with a really neat feature, the camera menu language is set to Chinese by default !!!! Try resetting that correctly if you don't have any comprehension of Chinese.

In fact, four times as many cameras are sold on the so called grey market as through regular shops which puts you with the majority.

I would like to see the factual figures behind that statement, I reckon if that is the case the major importers would be very close to closing their doors in Australia by now.

[Redgum]

I would like to see the factual figures behind that statement, I reckon if that is the case the major importers would be very close to closing their doors in Australia by now.

A piece I wrote for the "Age Technology" last year drew this response from Nikon (Europe) in response to my question on monopolization of markets. "Nikon Channel Marketers supply a little over twenty five percent of the world market across a broad Nikon range", they added "we expect that other major camera manufacturers, with the exclusion of Sony, enjoy similar outcomes".
Nikon Australia is a private company working under licence to Nikon Inc. and competes openly with other wholesalers.

[darrenmars]

Like anything else, you can minimise your risks by being aware of the possible risks and acting to mitigate them.

My general rule is never buy anything over $20 unless the seller has at least 99% +ve feedback, has been using eBay for longer than a year and has made more than 100 sales. I also prefer to only pay using paypal unless I know and trust the seller.

My two worst experiences to date was buying a kodak junior from a guy somewhere up north. When the camera arrived it stank like faeces. I demanded a refund and sent the camera back. He claimed there was nothing wrong with it... it was a bit of a saga but because I paid with paypal I was able to get my money back. A damn shame because it would have complimented my other folder very nicely!

The other horrid experience was when I purchased 2x used 24" screens from a reseller. Their condition was far from the description, one didn't even work and the seller wanted me to pay return postage... the whole thing dragged on for over 2 months somehow and I eventually got my refund (including postage).

It was these two experiences (and other minor incidents) that prompted me to be more stringent with who I buy from. I still have the odd dodgy from time to time but overall my experiences have greatly improved. I've purchased all kinds of stuff from computer parts to cameras and lenses, camera parts, things for the missus... eBay can be good as long as you are careful.

[I @ M]

A piece I wrote for the "Age Technology"

Can we have a link to the entire article and the complete Nikon Europe response please.

"Nikon Channel Marketers supply a little over twenty five percent of the world market across a broad Nikon range"

I don't know what a "Nikon Channel Marketer" is but the way I see things is that Nikon produce 100% of Nikon branded products.

Of that product range, 100% of those products are distributed in various countries around the world through Nikon authorised distributors.

Those distributors in the various countries are only supposed to sell the products they receive from Nikon to authorised dealers in that particular country.

If as you claim, only 25% of the products sold in Australia or the world for that matter happen through the authorised supply chain then Nikon has a lot of internal investigating to do as to who is selling what where seeing as they control 100% of the supply. It would seem that 75% of their product line must be going missing within their own network.

Nikon Australia is a private company working under licence to Nikon Inc. and competes openly with other wholesalers.

Nikon Australia has an absolute monopoly on the supply of non grey market Nikon products to authorised dealers in this country.
Perhaps you might like to read ---

http://www.nikon.com.au/aboutus.php

and in particular the line --- " In November 2006, Nikon Australia Pty Ltd, a wholly owned sales and service subsidiary was established in Sydney, NSW, Australia."

[sealhead]

Over the years my wife and I have had many successfull transactions (250+)on ebay mainly, buying. Unfortuneatly the law of averages kicked in a month ago and I was knowing deceived by the seller of a second hand dslr. PayPal has taken the issue into their hands and hopefully I will have a full refund by the end of this week (17-6-2011).

Will post result.

Moral of the story: only use PayPal to purchase items.

[I @ M]

Moral of the story: only use PayPal to purchase items.

Funnily enough I would rather use my credit card.
A straight forward approach to your credit card provider to cancel or reverse a payment or to have a refund applied can take as little as four hours.

To have a refund applied through pay$al, by their own quotation, will take 4 business days. It seems that they hang on to your money in their account for a little while "just in case", some cynics might say that they are earning interest on it during that period.
Needlessly to say, after one such episode with pay$al I cancelled both that account and the e$ay account.

It seems that more people are doing similar and only the other day I emailed an online store who only accepted pay$al to tell them that I refused to have an account with pay$al and that their store had missed out on a sale. They emailed back very quickly saying that they had noticed a decrease in sales due to their policy and that they would be happy to accept my credit card details over the phone.

[fabian628]

they would be crazy if they were not earning intrest on it

sealhead, What were the circumstances of your ordeal on ebay? Did they have low feedback, any negative feedback? could you pm me the listing?

[sealhead]

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI....m=260780241664

Hi Fab, the above link was the premeditated con from this young and deceitful cow. The seller adverised a Canon 1000d with a 18-200mm lens for $550 "buy it now". I only wanted the lens to go with a 450D I'd previously purchased of ebay for my daughter's 12th birthday as she is a keen little photographer. My logiic was the 18-200 would never leave the camera and give all the focal length she'd need and I'd on sell the 1000d and have a very inexpensive lens for my daughter. I messaged this lass to verify that it was a 'Canon' lens. This is the question and reply, quote. Me>"Hi, is the 18-200 lens a Canon and does the package come in original boxes?" Her> "Yeah comes in original packaging and yes its a Canon len"
With that written confirmation a purchased it using paypal.

Over a week later it arrived with only an 18-55 kit lens. I immediately contacted her trying hard not to drag her through the phone. Her reply was that she got a friend to list it and had spent the money. As you could understand I was blowing big time but composed I asked her to repay me asap. She said she would transfer the $575 back to me in a weeks time. You guessed it, no doe. I rang her to see what was going on and was abruptly told to "f**k off ****head".

That's when I lodged a claim with paypal. Yesterday the full amount was refunded to me, 5 weeks after the initial purchase. I am out of pocket $20 odd dollars for the postage back to the little darling and will not bother to retreive, enough time has been wasted.

The only warning sign that rang quiet alarm bells was her username: "ridebmxpunk" her low feedback (8) 100% positive was worthy of the risk. Using paypal is a risk management tool and in my opinion the only way to go. How could have I redeemed the money using any other legal method?

[fabian628]

they did not even bother to put up pictures of the item. low feedback, extremely vague destription is also a bit dodgey. To their credit they did sell a lens previously and it worked out but this time it seems they did not do well.
Some people really do not know the difference between a 18-55mm lens and an 18-200mm lens believe it or not! They are that blissfully ignorant. I guess you wanting your money back after getting a not as described item did not sit well with them. I hope you leave accurate negative feedback for them so they can at least write off that account, ebay does not need people like this. Luckily I have only had to leave negative feedback 3 times, over a few small issues (seller wanting extra money for postage, someone leaving nagative feedback without communicating; before you couldnt leave nega tive as a seller, and when the item was just rubbish and getting my money back would have not solved anything).

But yeah, that listing seemed a bit dodgey, sometimes you can get lucky and the seller doesnt know how much their equpitment is worth, but a too good to be true buy it now is risky business I recall a 500mm f/4 L IS for 4.5K buy it now, like new, looked at it later, ended up being fake from the feedback they got.

Anyway, glad to hear you got your money back.