Raw file colour appearance question - Lightroom 5

[JD88]

Hi all,
Just had a quick question regarding an issue I've encountered with how raw files appear when I upload them onto Lightroom 5. I took the attached photos shown below shooting in both RAW and jpeg (the jpeg image is on the left and the RAW image on the right).

However, after uploading the photos from my camera into Lightroom 5 for editing, some of the colours in the RAW file suddenly become overexposed or blown out. In particular this appears to largely affect blue colours (see the blue Christmas lights on the right of the photos). In contrast, this doesn’t occur on the jpeg file when imported into Lightroom and the colours in question look exactly as they should. Additionally, the settings for both the RAW and jpeg files were also almost exactly the same.

This occurs without any alterations made to the RAW file which has confused me as when I looked at it on the camera the photo looked fine and yet it suddenly changed upon upload to Lightroom. I understand that this may be because of the way Lightroom reads and processes raw files that are imported to it. However, is there any way to change its settings to stop these colours from appearing blown out? This is because I would prefer to use the RAW file but I can't because of this issue.

Any help much appreciated, Thanks!


Jpeg example 2.jpgRaw example 2.jpg

[ricktas]

You haven't accidentally set some sort of preset to be applied on import?

Also these are two separate photos, not the RAW and JPG of the same one. One was shot at 7.15.32pm and the other at 7.13.40pm. I have not looked further into the image data, but if you changed settings between the RAW and JPG that will influence variations on the resultant images. So it could well be operator induced at the time of capture, rather than something in Lightroom.

[Hawthy]

The easiest way to explain this is that your camera automatically adjusts the raw image capture and changes the exposure, saturation, etc. to produce a JPEG. With a raw image you are getting the image with no in-camera processing. However, the upside of shooting in raw is that you can adjust the raw image via Camera Raw in Lightroom or Photoshop to a much greater extent than you can a JPEG. No doubt someone will come along with a more detailed technical explanation but that is as I understand it.

If your camera is providing you with the image that you want shooting in JPEG just use that. If you want to be able to manipulate photos, in particular change white balance, pull back highlights, lighten shadows, etc. use raw.

Your skill level is Beginner so maybe JPEG is the way to go for a while. Don't be afraid of using raw but just don't expect the image out of the camera to be as sharp or vibrant as an out of camera JPEG.

Have a play around and enjoy yourself.

[ricktas]

.

Your skill level is Beginner so maybe JPEG is the way to go for a while. Don't be afraid of using raw but just don't expect the image out of the camera to be as sharp or vibrant as an out of camera JPEG.

We just upped the skill level to intermediate as these images were taken in 2015, and thus 3 years later (and three years of RAW photography), we felt beginner was not correct in this instance.

Looking further into the EXIF, one was a four second exposure, the other was a five second exposure. ISO 320 and fstop 7.1 remained unchanged. Which makes me believe the variance in brightness from one to the other was a result of a longer exposure time, not something in Lightroom.

As you leave the shutter open for longer, more light hits the sensor and thus the bright parts of the scene will appear brighter. This is the cause of the brighter (blown out) blue lights, not Lightroom.

if you want to compare a RAW file to a JPG file, you need to do so with two images taken using the exact same settings. The longer exposure is the reason for the variance in these two examples.

[Hawthy]

Congrats on your elevation to Intermediate.

[nardes]

I understand that when you "open" a Raw file in LR, then the Raw Converter in LR will interpret the data in that Raw file and display it on screen, based on a raw conversion process within the Raw Converter that LR uses. Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) is Adobe’s implementation of how Adobe thinks the Raw CR2 data should be displayed.

I suspect that Canon’s Digital Photo Professional (DPP) will provide a more accurate conversion, as the Canon DPP developers will have access to proprietary stuff that 3^rd party folks such as Adobe may have to guess at?

When you open e.g. a Canon CR2 Raw file in LR, the underlying Raw data (on the hard drive) is not changed even if the on-screen version is modified by ACR or by the user. When you save the on-screen rendered version as e.g. a PSD, TIF or JPG, it becomes a new file, leaving the original Raw CR2 unchanged, a bit like a film negative.

If you save the on-screen rendered image as e.g. a PSD or TIF then some stuff may be “baked in” but with a JPG, much more (all?) is "baked in" leaving less headroom to subsequently play with.

I think that PSDs and TIFs can be saved as "lossless" files, meaning that the “changed” data is not baked in but stored as meta data or a sidecar file that contains a recipe of the changes. But, when you save a Raw CR2 as a JPG, then it is a "lossy" save as Raw data is discarded and cannot be subsequently recovered from the JPG.

Unless you have measured the values in the so called blown out areas, the LR interpretation of your Raw file may not actually have blown out the blues – there could still be some texture or tonality still present which the JPG has discarded, albeit it could be very subtle.

Some of the blue lights appear to have smeared or moved in the right-hand image – maybe long exposure and gusts of wind?

Cheers

Dennis

[ameerat42]

Dennis, if you're wrong, then so am I -- and everybody else

JD, all is working just as it should

[JD88]

Hi, thank you for your replies.

The above photos are probably not the best example of the issue as the framing and settings as mentioned are slightly different. However, I still think that there is something wrong as the same effect has occurred on another occasion where I took a photo using the 'RAW + Fine Jpeg' setting on my camera and the RAW file showed the same colouring issue as above but the jpeg didn't. This is despite both images having identical settings.

RAW file (no changes made, only converted to Jpeg after export from Lightroom:
DSC_8487.jpg

Jpeg file:
DSC_8487-2.jpg

Also, I have not applied any Lightroom presets to these images so I don't believe that is the cause. Does Lightroom automatically apply presets to any photos imported?

Thanks

[ricktas]

I copied both those images to my computer and over-layed them in photoshop. I cannot see any significant difference. If there is a difference it could well be your monitor causing it. Is your monitor calibrated with a hardware colorimeter (like a Spyder or Munki)?

The histogram of each show that there is blown highlights, especially in the blue channel. But this appears on the histogram of both images.

Ulitmately, this is going to happen when you have very dark areas of a scene, interspersed with very bright areas. It is a limitation of the sensors we have in our cameras. One of the rules of photography is to expose for the hightlights, thus you will not get blown highlights and it is much easier to recover shadow area in post processing and do so quite well. Whereas a blown highlight is just that and is unlikely to be able to be effectively recovered. A faster shutter speed would have helped with these. Again it is not a limitation of Lightroom, it is a result of the shooting settings used being outside the ability of the camera sensor.

[Glenda]

"...when I looked at it on the camera the photo looked fine..." As far as I know the image you see on your camera's LCD is actually a jpeg preview rendered by the camera, even if you shoot raw only. If you check your histogram or have your blinkies on it would probably show blown highlights if that is what is happening in your raw capture. In the jpeg image the camera has already made alterations to exposure/contrast/shadows/highlights/colour/sharpening etc which you need to do to your raw file yourself.

[mpb]

and the RAW file showed the same colouring issue as above but the jpeg didn't. This is despite both images having identical settings.

Hawthy in post 3 and Glenda above have provided the answer. Your camera processes the raw file to produce the jpeg, that is it changes things, so even though they have the same settings they will look different because of the changes made by the camera.

Even if you shoot in only raw, your camera produces a jpeg thumbnail image which is displayed on the LCD.

[JD88]

Thanks guys, just wanted to check that it wasn't a Lightroom error. Thank you all for the helpful advice,

Cheers

[ricktas]

Thanks guys, just wanted to check that it wasn't a Lightroom error. Thank you all for the helpful advice,

Cheers

Now that people have helped you, how about returning the favour and checking out what others have posted and give them some help too.