I am a photographer - NOT a paedophile

[markdphotography]

I drove for 2 hours to Brisbane yesterday with 3 photography projects in mind - Marvel Comic Exhibition, Narcisus Garden at the Art Gallery (chrome balls in the water exhibit) and car trails.

Between project 2 finishing and project 3 starting, I called by Southbank and saw a water park. I decided to stop and take a few IR mono images and rather than use a long lens and hide, I used a wide angle lens and was "in full view" and mindful that none of the images had naked or scantilly clad children. After taking a few images I was spoken to by 2 Security Guards arrived and informed me that 3 parents had complained about me taking pictures. Once asked I stopped and packed up my gear. I gave them a business card and asked that they pass the information on to the complainants if they had any concerns. After they left I remembered the publicity that Ken Duncan had for some years and "Goggled" the title of this thread. I found the following article by Susie O'Brien which I condensed below.

Not every man with a camera is a paedophile, says Susie O’Brien

Extract from an article by Susie O’Brien, Herald Sun May 8, 2015 11:51am

Not every man with a camera is a paedophile. .....................................................

Try to remember this next time you see a man take a photo in a public place.

Sadly, we live in a world where just about every male adult with children is seen in a suspect light, every person with a camera is a potential paedophile, and every stranger is a criminal.

It’s no wonder people increasingly say they wouldn’t stop to help a distressed kid anymore for fear of having their motives questioned.

Through social media people are causing panic by posting photos and personal details of suspected paedophiles online — in some cases without any evidence that the person had committed, or is likely to commit, a crime.

Even though many people freely share the most intimate details of their own children’s lives on social media, they are up in arms at the thought of someone else whipping out a camera in a public place or idly chatting to a child at a playground.

All this paranoia means children are increasingly living sheltered lives indoors, spending their time on computer screens rather than actually experiencing the world.

Ironically, children at much more at risk of harm in their own home from someone they know than a stranger.

Sadly this is not the first time that this issue has arisen for me. Some years ago I was photographing the sunrise at Dickey Beach (the wreck). As the sun came up, a group of school children (teeenagers) walked onto the beach. A techaer with the group told meto stop taking photos of them. I politely told him to get his students out of my photos - the best way to prevent photos being taken. I was breaking no law and had as much right as them and as courtesy they should stop walking into my images.

On another occassion, I was photographing (blurred images) people riding a walking over the Goodwill Bridge in Brisbane at sunset. A cyclist brushed passed me and yelled "paedohile" . The people in the image could not even be identified. With some of them stopping to take selfies and post on social media.

Having recently purchased a drone, I am surpried at the people who have made remarks about photographing their back yard yet they are not concerned about neighbour using a camera to photograph them?

Why don't people just stop and think before saying exactly what jumps into their head. I reckon that there are are a far greater number of males with cameras that do the right thing.

I think I may have to purchase a tshirt with the slogan below on it.

[Glenda]

Sad but true. I was photographing my grandchildren at our local water park once and I had a guy come over and start asking advice about buying a dslr. I guess if my husband had been the photographer that day it may have been different. Although, even as a female I feel uncomfortable photographing children I don't know nowadays. Some true statements in that article, generally, children are more at risk from someone they know than a stranger, and it constantly amazes me what some parents post on social media about their children. I wonder what the reaction would have been had you been using a phone to photograph the scene. For some reason people see them as normal and innocuous whereas a dslr is seen as intrusive.

[tandeejay]

Wouldn't a pedophile be more likely to try and hide the fact they were taking photos? So someone with a big DSLR would be far less likely to be one?

[nardes]

Sorry to hear of the rather sad tale, it seems that there is little you can do to alleviate the fears and concerns of others, whether they be rational or irrational.

Maybe wearing a T-shirt identifying you as a photographer is the only way - shame that the photography community would have to go to such lengths.

Cheers

Dennis

[markdphotography]

Wouldn't a pedophile be more likely to try and hide the fact they were taking photos? So someone with a big DSLR would be far less likely to be one?

Yes that is what I thought also.

[Mary Anne]

I feel for you Mark as I know exactly what you mean. So why pick on Males with a camera.
There has to be Paedophiles out there hiding under the guise of Female and most people think nothing of that.
Its sad that Society has gone this way, its not a very nice world out there is it.

Though if you wear a shirt like that, sadly a Paedophile could wear one too

[Cris]

I always take my other half with me, seems to stop the interference. Cant figure out why, she's only 5'2".

[markdphotography]

Though if you wear a shirt like that, sadly a Paedophile could wear one too

Yes just as a paedophile could take their partner with them. I have problems with the situation for several reasons.

Firstly - every one is innocent till proven guilty - just look at the treatment that other get that are charged with a crime - in my case definitely no charges. I would be happy to provide a name, address and details and even get a "Blue" card.
Secondly - I have done nothing wrong and been found guilty by inuendo.
Thirdly - if we stopped all things that are unsafe, we would have no more cars on the road, no knives in our kitchensor even no mobile phones as they distract people while using them just to name a few. My guess is that more a killed or bullied by mobile phones than are hurt by paedophiles.

Look I am not negating the seriousness of the issue BUT the unreasonable paronia is just ridiculous. I have a grand daughter also and seeing what other people share on the internet it iust ridiculous guilty by association with a camera statement.

Have a look at the images on the camera, record the name and address, ask the people if they spoke to the photographer.

[Geoff79]

Some true stuff in there for sure. It's a bit different for me as I'm always taking photos of my own kids, but even then I always feel very self conscious about what parents of others kids are thinking, should I be shooting snaps at a playground or beach or something public like that.

To avoid issues I make sure other kids are never in the pics I take of my two, but then again, other parents don't know that unless they review the pics. But sometimes other kids in the pics can't be avoided, though, and I always have it in the back of my mind that someone might approach me one day with issues relating to my presence.

Anyway, playing devils advocate, I guess I could understand a protective parent being a little uncomfortable about a lone male taking photos in an area heavily populated by children, when the specifics aren't known to them (ie. lens, photographers intentions etc). I'm definitely not saying the above story is okay, and it's sad that the world has come to this, but I can definitely see both sides to the story. Obviously if the facts were known to everyone (maybe if the shirt was being worn, lol) we could all just get along, but people do love making a nice, general and sweeping assumption.

Again on the flip side, I'm also amazed by what people post about their kids on social media. I personally find it ridiculous on many levels. My wife lives on Facebook but has never posted a pic of our kids on there.


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[markdphotography]

Anyway, playing devils advocate, I guess I could understand a protective parent being a little uncomfortable about a lone male taking photos in an area heavily populated by children, when the specifics aren't known to them (ie. lens, photographers intentions etc). I'm definitely not saying the above story is okay, and it's sad that the world has come to this, but I can definitely see both sides to the story. Obviously if the facts were known to everyone (maybe if the shirt was being worn, lol) we could all just get along, but people do love making a nice, general and sweeping assumption.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I now have a little grand daughter and I tried to see it from the parents perspective overnight - I really did and even spoke to my daughter about it. She posts images (and so do we) of our grand daughter on FB and apply the same rules as adult images. Now I know they they did not know if the images were infrared, all children were fully clothed, the adults were there taking images on their phone and I did not approach any kids or parents. The security guards could have looked at my images on the card, not all images were of kids. If the parents had of taken the same images would that be OK? I will bet that the complainants did not get any feedback from the security guards after speaking to me. They will feel they have stopped a paedophile and done a great commuity service.

Mind you this is the same rule that does not allow parents to take images of their kids at surf and swimming carnivals which is also a crazy rule. As the journalists article states I will bet that more children are abused both physically and sexulally by people they know but we have not banned pregnacy or parenthood.

[Geoff79]

I now have a little grand daughter and I tried to see it from the parents perspective overnight - I really did and even spoke to my daughter about it. She posts images (and so do we) of our grand daughter on FB and apply the same rules as adult images. Now I know they they did not know if the images were infrared, all children were fully clothed, the adults were there taking images on their phone and I did not approach any kids or parents. The security guards could have looked at my images on the card, not all images were of kids. If the parents had of taken the same images would that be OK? I will bet that the complainants did not get any feedback from the security guards after speaking to me. They will feel they have stopped a paedophile and done a great commuity service.

Mind you this is the same rule that does not allow parents to take images of their kids at surf and swimming carnivals which is also a crazy rule. As the journalists article states I will bet that more children are abused both physically and sexulally by people they know but we have not banned pregnacy or parenthood.

Yeah, definitely don't get me wrong that I am "siding" with the people who complained. If it was me, I certainly wouldn't have... nor would my wife, or in all honesty, probably anyone we know. But in this often irritating, and stupidly politically correct world we live in, I can definitely understand how this happened.

Out of curiosity, how were the security guards with you? Did they give you the impression they thought you could be a genuine concern? Or did they come across more like "these people have complained and even though we know you're not doing anything wrong, we've got to be seen to be doing our job" kind of thing?

[markdphotography]

Yeah, definitely don't get me wrong that I am "siding" with the people who complained. If it was me, I certainly wouldn't have... nor would my wife, or in all honesty, probably anyone we know. But in this often irritating, and stupidly politically correct world we live in, I can definitely understand how this happened.

Out of curiosity, how were the security guards with you? Did they give you the impression they thought you could be a genuine concern? Or did they come across more like "these people have complained and even though we know you're not doing anything wrong, we've got to be seen to be doing our job" kind of thing?

There were 2 and 1 did most of the talking. While not wanting to look at the images on the camera (I offerred them my business card which they took) they did not harass me. To be fair to them they did not escort me away as I packed up my camera gear immediately. On saying that they were also probably watching from their security camera and could see I was complying with their request. Here is one of the images.

[Geoff79]

Very nicely captured shot. Loving the water portion of it. Good to hear the security guards weren' too over-the-top about it.

[markdphotography]

Very nicely captured shot. Loving the water portion of it. Good to hear the security guards weren' too over-the-top about it.

Thanks. This little guy was just keeping himself entertained catching the water sprays that went on and off and it was hard to capture the enjoyment he was having but this comes close. I think the parents would have liked it if they had a chance to see it.

[Cage]

Your post reminded me about something that happened to me a few years ago.

I was walking along the street not far from my home when I saw a little girl, probably about three years old, coming down her driveway on a dinky. When she hit the street, right in front of me, she fell off, grazing her knee. She was laying on the road howling, and my immediate reaction was to pick her up and comfort her.

As I was bending down to pick her up the thought crossed my mind that at any second the door of her house was going to open, and an angry parent was going to see their daughter in a strangers arms, crying her eyes out.

So what did I do? I picked up her dinky and ushered the distraught child off the road to her house. I had to knock several times on the door before her mother answered, and the look on her face, that 'what the hell have you done to my child look' sort of made me feel in some way justified in my actions, fleetingly.

I still have guilt feelings about allowing peoples misconceptions stopping me from acting like a normal, caring human being.

[Nick Cliff]

I can see both sides of the problem and I try to avoid photographing people in public places as a rule myself.
I wonder if the parents that post photos of their children on the internet could have some legal problems in the future. I do not know how Australia leans on these issues.
Women can have problems too Cage doing the right thing. My wife once hastily grabbed a girl running to cross a road to join her mother as a dark colored car sped around a corner, she held the child until the car passed while the parent was understandably upset and swearing at my wife who then let the child proceed safety with no thanks from the mother for possibly saving the child from serious injury or death, only a stony silence. That child will now have a memory of having been restrained by a stranger rather than possibly saved sadly.

cheers Nick

[Roane Photo]

Unfortunately the best way to avoid situations like this is simple, don't take pictures of other peoples children unless you have prior permission to do so. I will take pics of teens and adults in the public places but will not ever take pics of children for fear of this exact thing happening. Someone has said that "it's not a very nice world out there" I totally disagree, I believe the world is a beautiful and amazing place we just have to modify some of our behaviors because of the behavior of a few spoiling it for us, not a big deal compromise is something we all have to do to get along in this wonderful world of ours.

[rellik666]

I've been away from the scene recently as I've now got two young children and I'm sorry but I'd be pretty upset if you were taking photos of my kids. I'm very protective of my photos of my kids. Maybe overly so but I don't care what your intentions are with the photos the only photos I want out there are ones I have some kind of control over. I do post photos on FB but for my friends only and they are few and far between. I understand that they are people in a public place but it's not about you the innocent person taking candids it what you choose to do with that image that I have no control over. I'm not paranoid I just don't want my kids images in places I don't know about if I can help it. Personally I never take photos of other people's kids. As I assume everyone feels the same way.

As far as the other side of sneaky photos and paedophiles I'm definitely more aware of the iPhone shot than someone obviously taking shots with a proper camera.

I'm not having a go but asking you to see it from the other side. People in general are fair game but I think some restraint is needed with kids, especially young kids.

[markdphotography]

Unfortunately the best way to avoid situations like this is simple, don't take pictures of other peoples children unless you have prior permission to do so. I will take pics of teens and adults in the public places but will not ever take pics of children for fear of this exact thing happening. Someone has said that "it's not a very nice world out there" I totally disagree, I believe the world is a beautiful and amazing place we just have to modify some of our behaviors because of the behavior of a few spoiling it for us, not a big deal compromise is something we all have to do to get along in this wonderful world of ours.

Shane - that could easily be reversed and parents who are concerned about people taking photos of their kids in public - don't take them into a public place. What I was doing is not illegal or agaainst the law, it is against a fear or phobia that people have. Children like adults and teenagers, take more natural photos when captured in a candid moment rather than a posed shot. Children display a real different feeling of sponteneity, playfulness, intrigue and so many other traits.


This fear or phobia is part of a wider issue and it is the growing number of phobias, homophobia, islamaphobia and cameraphobia is another manifestation of social media news cycle. This rule even goes as far as not allowing parents to take photos of their own children at some sporting events as other children may be photographed.As the journalists points out, children are far more likely to be abused - emotionally and physically by someone they know.


I understand that most rules are made to protect the majority from stupid actions by the minority and in this instance this fear is a developed country first world fear. Some years ago I travelled overseas, took photos of families and children, got their name and address and when I got home sent prints I had taken to them at no charge. Thay had no photos at all of their children


Just like all muslims are not terrorists, all people with cameras who are taking photos of children do not have bad intentions.


Taking this rule to the extreme, imagine if no one was allowed to take photos of other children, I am sure that adults without children or mature people would miss out on a lot of happiness.


Just like banning cars as a result of car accidents, stopping other people from taking photos of children in public places will not stop paedophilia. Portrait competitons would not include photos of children but nothing is more common than the lack of common sense.


Roo - I understand you are not having a go and I have looked at it from the other side. I respect your opinion (and all other opinions), I am expressing mine and hope that you can see it from my perspective also.

[rellik666]

I do understand but I think you have slightly missed my point. In my case I'm not worried about paedophiles but the ease of photo availability in a digital world. It's not like having a film, it's too easy for photos to go viral for want of a better word. I don't want pics of my kids out there. End of. I feel the percentage of people with bad intentions is so low (although I did recently have a bad experience with some people with an iPhone acting very suss) but what happens to that photo you took, where will end up when you just innocently share it on here or on photo site.