Pentax full frame 35mm official announcement from Ricoh (K-1 36mp)

[arthurking83]

I see the Aust. distributor has the K-1 on their website for $3188.90, but there is chatter (PentaxForums) that dealers are setting a price somewhere around $2800-2900.

Cheers,
Terry

Yeah but do note that the people making those price decisions seem to be affected by some drugs(illicit or otherwise) as the pricing structure is just a tad convoluted on that site.

K3 Body only listing is @ $1518.00

yet the K3-II body only listing is @ $1349.00

ps. it's almost certain that someone has mucked up the website and confused the two listings(ie. should be switched around). The cameras plus lens kits seem to make more sense price wise.

[tduell]

Yes, I saw the K-3 and K-3 II pricing. It doesn't make a lot of sense.

Cheers,
Terry

[tduell]

The distributor has updated their website price, now shown as $2899.
Getting better, but still room for improvement.

Cheers,
Terry

[Steve Axford]

I wonder how Pentax can have a price that is heaps better than Canon or Nikon or Sony? Is this a strategy to to have a "loss leader" or is it some new found efficiencies?
I also wonder if a shot taken using pixel shift at 1 second exposure (ie 4 secs total) and ISO 800 would have similar noise to a non-ps shot taken at 4secs and iso 200?
Shame about the lack of good video, but I guess that doesn't matter to most people here.

[MissionMan]

I wonder how Pentax can have a price that is heaps better than Canon or Nikon or Sony? Is this a strategy to to have a "loss leader" or is it some new found efficiencies?
I also wonder if a shot taken using pixel shift at 1 second exposure (ie 4 secs total) and ISO 800 would have similar noise to a non-ps shot taken at 4secs and iso 200?
Shame about the lack of good video, but I guess that doesn't matter to most people here.

I think that is marketing strategy. They need to penetrate an established market. That means you can't price yourself the same because you don't have the selection of lenses and accessories to compete. It gives you a chance to build your customer base and improve your margins later. Same as a new pro photographer.


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[tduell]

I wonder how Pentax can have a price that is heaps better than Canon or Nikon or Sony? Is this a strategy to to have a "loss leader" or is it some new found efficiencies?
I also wonder if a shot taken using pixel shift at 1 second exposure (ie 4 secs total) and ISO 800 would have similar noise to a non-ps shot taken at 4secs and iso 200?
Shame about the lack of good video, but I guess that doesn't matter to most people here.

That's a good question. From what Pentax (Ricoh) have said it seems that they are expecting the market to be existing Pentax users which would suggest that the price isn't aimed at undercutting the competition.
Re the noise question, that's also a good one. I'll have to test that.

Cheers,
Terry

[swifty]

I wonder how Pentax can have a price that is heaps better than Canon or Nikon or Sony? Is this a strategy to to have a "loss leader" or is it some new found efficiencies?
I also wonder if a shot taken using pixel shift at 1 second exposure (ie 4 secs total) and ISO 800 would have similar noise to a non-ps shot taken at 4secs and iso 200?
Shame about the lack of good video, but I guess that doesn't matter to most people here.

I think noise characteristics could be quite similar given the total exposure is the same (assuming the same aperture is used). But in practice its quite possible the sensor shift process and combining data could introduce more read noise. If the sensor is truly ISOless, then in theory I think it should be the same but although read noise is very low on the Sony 36MP sensor, its not quite ISOless yet.
This is disregarding any thermal noise differences between a longer shutter speed vs a sensor shift mechanism if that is a factor at all. It'd be interesting to find out when the camera arrive in photographer's hands.

The pricing and the poorer video specs are probably indirectly related. The sensor is not new and the video bar has moved since the sensor was originally designed. But because its not new, yield and pricing on this sensor is probably very good allowing Pentax to price it very aggressively.

[Steve Axford]

I guess we will have to wait until the camera is shipped. Who makes the sensor?

[Lance B]

I guess we will have to wait until the camera is shipped. Who makes the sensor?

I would say it is the same Sony sensor as that which is in the D800/D800E/D810.

[Steve Axford]

I thought it probably was. The price makes more sense now as that chip could be cheaper now, or perhaps there was a technology swap??? It will be interesting to see who picks up the PS technology. There were rumours that Canon was interested, perhaps Sony are too.

[tduell]

There has been some 'chatter' on PentaxForums that the sensor isn't the same as D810 et al, but very difficult to come to any conclusion as to how factual that was.

Cheers,
Terry

[arthurking83]

I would say it is the same Sony sensor as that which is in the D800/D800E/D810.

For sure it will be.
36Mp 24x26 frame sensor .. who else makes such a device?

So with this in mind, the (low)price of the camera is most likely due to already established technology.

Like Swifty commented on pricing and yield ...
That is, the sensor has been around since 2012, still relevant as a technology and Pentax has some (again already established) tech that can linked to this sensor to create new features(pixel shift) .. etc. etc.

And I think the low price is simply due to Pentax's philosophy of lesser corporate greed.

If you compare a pro level APS-C sensor camera from Pentax(ie. K3 lineup against both Nikon's (D300/500 or Canon's 7D series) the Pentax has always had a price advantage from new release status!

Nikon's have always been overpriced(by Nikon .. not the dealers) and Canon's have mainly been on the reasonable side .. but Pentax has had a well mannered pricing regime ever since I can recall.

[mudman]

this may be a silly question, or already covered here, if i buy a K1, will the image quality be affected using my current lenses. they are, i assume configured for AFS/C cameras

[Kym]

this may be a silly question, or already covered here, if i buy a K1, will the image quality be affected using my current lenses. they are, i assume configured for AFS/C cameras

Basically no.
Any Pentax K mount lens that is a 35mm lens (e.g. FA series) will be ok.
Any lens that is specifically APS-C (DA series) can be used in crop mode, or they will vignette.

See: http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/lens/k/

And: http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/japan...Mount_Lens.pdf <<Roadmap picture

The same for 3rd party lenses. I have 9 K-mount lenses only 2 are APS-C only.

Edit: Sigma DC series are APS-C and DG are 35mm, both will work and the K-1 can run in APS-C mode.

[Kym]

Will be interesting to see what US$1799 translates to when CRK get stock, they have managed to keep some of the lenses comparable to US$. Hopefully not over $A2500.

Looks like the starting price will be $2,800 as quoted by a couple of dealers (Ted's and Photographic Wholesalers)

[arthurking83]

18-250 almost certainly won't cover the K1's full frame.
Although, saying that, at least the lens will mount onto the camera and you can shoot in crop mode if that's helpful.
You obviously only get 15Mp resultant image but that's still heaps.
(more on this later)

Dunno about Pentax 100 macro tho. Dunno nothing about this lens .. best to check it out yerself.

Sigma 50-500 is a 135 format lens, so no problems with that one either.

As for the crop lens.
After I got my D800E a few years ago, I ummed and ahhed for a long time as to which wide angle lens I wanted to get for it.
Took me more than a year to finally decide(idiot me went to a show and played with Nikon's 16-35/4 VR and the 18-35 AF-S lenses too .. as I had my heart set on a 14-24/2.8.
But I also wanted to be as wide as I could possibly go too .. and thought hard about getting the Sigma 12-24II as well.

But until I actually decided what to do, I kept on using the humble little Sigma 10-20mm lens I've had since I got my first DSLR back in 2006!
While it obviously can't cover the full D800 frame, that never bothered me so much, and always had it in mind to crop the resultant images.
The one significant advantage of shooting with the D800 + 10-20, rather than still using the much easier to frame D300, was that I could crop more than the APS-C frame that the D300 could do.
I could crop the D800 image to a 1:1 frame format, therefore allowing more of the frame to be captured.
So for a very short time, I shot the D800 and 10-20 in Dx crop mode(just to save hassles later), but then soon went back to the full frame and cropped in PP at home once I was happy with the image framing.
Cropping in PP is actually super easy anyhow, as you can batch this in some software easily.
As a rough estimate, I'd say that the D800 + 10-20 lens would give me about a 13mm lens FOV when cropped to 1:1 format, but with heavy vignetting in the corners(which I didn't mind too much anyhow).

After a year, I ended up getting the Sigma 12-24 lens as a temporary wide angle with the idea that I was going to get the Nikon 16-35/4VR lens as the other more versatile wide angle lens(ie. filters and VR and so forth).
Still haven't got the Nikon lens yet!

so, don't be worried about lens use if you're thinking you'd like a new camera to play with.
I'd say at the least getting the K-1 will give you a massive increase in dynamic range compared to what you already have in your camera.
(that was one other significant step up I saw in the D800 from the D300 too!)
Once you have the camera, just use what you have, and can, and are willing to endure .. and then look at new lens options at your leisure .. ie. if and when you can afford/justify them.

[Cage]

......... lesser corporate greed.

An oxymoron if ever I've seen one.

[swifty]

For sure it will be.
36Mp 24x26 frame sensor .. who else makes such a device?

Only Sony that I know of so most are assuming this although we won't know for sure until Chipworks pulls one apart and put it under their microscope.
But economically I can't imagine Pentax using any other sensor developed just for a K1 which would be a low volume seller. The costs would be huge and not in line with the RRP. Whereas the Sony 36MP sensor has already been shared amongst the Nikon D800/800E/810 and Sony A7r.
Of course Pentax will add their own 'toppings' on the sensor so image characteristics will differ a bit.
But as you wrote earlier on in the thread, primary specs like FPS that are based on bandwidth can't differ much no matter how much better the supporting electronics are.

[arthurking83]

....
Of course Pentax will add their own 'toppings' on the sensor so image characteristics will differ a bit.....

For sure Pentax will have specified their own toppings .. stuff like color filter array microlenses and whatever else that goes on top.

Pentax has had a good history of extracting more performance out of their sensors than Sony has .. and probably a bit better than Nikon has in past model that have used the 'same' sensor.

Whether this is all down to software, either in camera or externally, or due to Pentax specifying slight variations on the sensor .. who really knows(other than Sony/Pentax/Nikon).

[Glen1]

Well, I for one, can't wait for the new K1 to start selling. I don't want one (can't afford it), but there's sure to be some low-mileage K3's on the market. Yay!!

Regards
Glen1