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Thread: Lightroom camera profile resources

  1. #1
    Ausphotography Regular swifty's Avatar
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    Lightroom camera profile resources

    I'm increasingly dissatisfied with the 'Adobe Standard' camera profile as the default camera profile in lightroom, particularly with my Olympus files and I can't say I'm too fond of the other presets either. I have to work quite hard to get to where I want the image to be frequently.
    I've read recently that software such as Capture One recognises the camera RAW files based on the camera model and will assign a different default based on the camera automatically.
    And I have learnt that Lightroom can also do this too, setting the camera profile based on the serial number.
    So short of creating them myself with a colour checker, are there resource databases where people share their camera profiles?
    Or should I give Capture One a go, instead of upgrading to LR6?
    Nikon FX

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    Arch-Σigmoid Ausphotography Regular ameerat42's Avatar
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    Swifty. Excusify me for sounding dUMb, but does Olympus not offer a raw converter?

    Your signature doesn't list an Olympus camera, but I guess you have one.

    If yes to "ALL of the above", what results do you get?
    CC, Image editing OK.

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    Ausphotography Regular
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    Am: yes, Olympus do have their own RAW converter but I'm used to my workflow in Lightroom and hence was looking for better results within my current workflow.
    Actually it's not really getting better results, I think the final results are fine. I actually mean needing to work less to get there so if I can start from a better starting point with a camera specific profile I think it should make life easier.
    Sorry, I've only listed m43 in my signature which in my case consists of an Olympus E-M1 and E-M5, one with a Panasonic sensor and the other a Sony variant so they should require separate profiles.

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    Ausphotography Regular J.davis's Avatar
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    Make an import preset to get the basics down pat, then go from there.
    I have a basic D750 preset and a landscape preset that I use, and in addition to the presets, I have the same settings with over and under exposures.
    I import my files with one of the Base presets, and sometimes change to one of the exposure preset in the Develop Module.

    Capture.JPG
    Regards
    John
    Nikon D750, Sigma 105mm OS Macro, Tokina 16-28 F2.8, Sigma 24-105 Art, Sigma 150-600C,
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    Hi John. Thanks for the suggestion but I'm not entirely sure that will do the trick.
    The camera profiles are changing the way the RAW converter is interpreting/extrapolate the colour info.
    Aren't the presets essentially a set of predefined adjustments on top of that? Or am I misunderstanding how LR works here?

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    Ausphotography Regular J.davis's Avatar
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    They are your adjustments, saved and applied later.
    If your reds are wrong to your eye, adjust them in the develop module and save the setting as a preset.
    When you import your pics, apply your preset on import and all pics will have the same red adjustment.
    Can do for any adjustment you like.


    Part of my D750 preset

    Capture.1.JPG

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    Thanks again John. I've delved a little more into the difference between between camera profiles and presets.
    As I thought presets are a list of edit instructions, something akin to 'actions' in Photoshop except it isn't sequential. So the additive/subtractive nature of LR could make the presets work except you don't get a 'zero'd' out base line.
    But I still get the feeling camera profiles is really what I want.
    Taking the Nikon profiles as an example. The D2x v1 I find far more preferable to Adobe standard and it's pretty clear that the files respond very differently under each profile. And if I had to edit an Adobe standard to D2x v1 profile, firstly the sliders are not quite precise enough and secondly there would likely entail quite large changes to slider positions, limiting further adjustments. As LR adjustments are additive/subtractive, there could be canceling out of the preset edits too, with later edits. Whereas in camera profiles you're just at a different start point before applying any edits vs wrong start point->apply presets to right start point->apply further edits that might cancel out your presets.
    Dunno if I'm making sense now.

    Also it appears Adobe standard profiles are actually unique to each camera but they are just all labelled the same.
    Dunno if it's s proprietary RAW thing but not really liking Adobe's defaults. Maybe native DNG supported cameras get better results.

    - - - Updated - - -

    It appears that Adobe does advocate the use of presets to refine your camera's colour by using the Camera Calibration panel.
    http://help.adobe.com/en_US/lightroo...BC919EC7C.html
    Will have to give that a go.
    Going back to the Nikon example of Adobe standard vs D2X v1, it appears to differ not just in colour but also contrast/tonal response and how the highlights/shadows are handled. This is where I don't really want to have to start having presets with highlight/shadow and curve adjustments already because this will limit future edits I'd want to do.

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    A royal pain in the bum! arthurking83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swifty View Post
    ..... Whereas in camera profiles you're just at a different start point before applying any edits vs wrong start point->apply presets to right start point->apply further edits that might cancel out your presets.
    Dunno if I'm making sense now.

    .....
    Yep! sure do(make sense that is)

    LR's presets are similar to in camera profiles.
    As I have more usage of those concepts with Nikon cameras, and not much with other camera brands(just very limited Canon experience) .. the similarities are Nikon calls those profiles Picture Controls, Canon call them Picture Styles .. and other manufacturers call them whatever.
    In a nutshell .. they are the same thing. They all create a start point with respect to colour balance, colour saturation, sharpening, tonal range and tone curves.

    I haven't used LR for quite some time, but one of dislikes about it was that I could never achieve an initial look to any image using the respectively similar named Profiles in Lr to give a look even remotely similar to Nikon's software.
    That is, if I tried Adobe's built in Landscape profile(which supposedly mimics Nikon's Landscape Picture Control) .. the images look like chalk and cheese(to quote a famous Aussie F1 legend!)

    It makes sense that Adobe's Profiles will be unique to each camera model, as they generally use different sensors. I guess if the sensor is shared across the various model range(ie. the 24Mp Dx sensor of the D3300, D5300 and D7200(among other models that use that sensor too) .. then the profiles will probably be similar and then tweaked in some way if needed.

    That last comment apparently allows the use of LR(or ACR in general) even if the model is unsupported.
    eg. when the D750(Nikon's last 24Mp Fx sensor camera came to market, and Adobe hadn't readied their profile for it(yet) .. you could haxor a D750 raw file to fool ACR/LR into thinking that the D750 file was indeed a D600/610 file.
    That Hack required the use of a hex editor to simply alter one small bit of data in the raw file(the bit that says D750 obviously). As the sensors are for all intents and purposes the same sensor, many folks used that when the D750 was only barely to market.

    I dunno enough about LR to help all that much, and over the last few years have come to realise that it wasn't my best move to spend the $99 I did on it.
    It just doesn't do what I thought it would do for me .. and because of that I haven't used it much at all.

    From what I do understand of Adobe's profile system, the best next step would be to take some time to create one(or some) profiles that you are generally happy with.
    Of course that's easy to say at my end .. not knowing if you have a colour checker to use for that purpose.

    Have you used Nikon's software much, or at all? If so, have you seen or used their Picture Control editor.
    When you install some of their software, the Picture Control editor is also installed, which allows you to edit the look of their Picture Controls(PC), to something that you're more happy with.
    So, as an example if the Portrait PC was too contrasty! .. you could use this editor to adjust the tone curve, colours, etc in most ways to effect this change if you wanted/needed.
    (the bonus was that if you used Nikon's software, you could upload this new PC to the camera to eliminate having to change to the new PC in software on the computer. It removed one step in PP)

    If you have ever used this Picture Control editor, is it anything like what Adobe's Profile editing system is like. You said the controls are not quite precise enough.
    In Nikon's PC editor, you could do the most wild and extreme edits .. but it was always extremely difficult to edit one PC to look like another(eg. say the Neutral PC to look like the Vivid PC).
    (I suppose it could be done if you had the time and patience).
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    Ausphotography Regular
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    Thanks Arthur.
    I guess this is what I was trying to figure out when John suggested the presets option because I wasn't really sure what the difference were.
    ie. Are there any difference between using a better (subjectively) camera profile as a starting point compared to a set of presets as suggested by John other than having a clean slate of zero'd out sliders to start with on every image?
    I guess I'm just looking for an easier way since I seem to find myself having less and less time to devote to this hobby.
    I haven't looked into exactly how to create profiles but there are plenty of tutorials but I don't own a colour checker yet. But I doubt I would have the time to do so.
    In regards to Nikon's software, the reason I haven't looked in depth is I need a universal RAW conversion software as I shoot with multiple brands. At the moment it's just Nikon and Olympus but I've owned Panasonic, Fuji and Canon RAW capable cameras in the past too.
    I find my Nikon files less problematic. Not sure if it's because my D700 is a very mature product but like I mentioned, the D2x profiles are usually quite pleasing to begin with.
    The comment about the precision of adjustment is largely to do with the tonal curve in Lightroom which are divided into bands whilst selecting a contrast level, unlike PS where you can 'lock' as many points as you like. I understand you can change the crossover point for each band but the whole process is geared towards a simple global adjustments vs precise fine tonal adjustments, I find.

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