Do you feel threatened by terrorists in Australia?

[Nick Cliff]

Careful MM you may be about to trigger WW3 .

[Kym]

Christian Crusades centuries ago, attacking muslims, have created generations of hatred, that is passed down from parents to children.

And this is really really really incorrect.

Consider this:

1. The crusades initially were a response to a request from the Byzantine (Constantinople) empire who were being attacked by muslims
2. There were a few crusades (7 major and more minor ones); whereas there were more than 500 islamic 'crusades' over a much longer period (more than 1000 years)
   (Consider that islamic expansion went into Europe and nearly took over Spain; i.e. the moorish invasion)
3. Islamic violent expansion took over most of North Africa and 99% of the middle east
   eg. islam wiped out the then Christian Egypt 639 - 642

The whole 'how bad were the crusades' argument does not stack up with historical fact.
Islam has consistently produced more violence then any other ideology over history

Lets look at what led up to the first crusade...

634—644 The Caliphate of Umar ibn al—Khattab, who is regarded as particularly brutal.
635 Muslim Crusaders besiege and conquer of Damascus
636 Muslim Crusaders defeat Byzantines decisively at Battle of Yarmuk.
637 Muslim Crusaders conquer Iraq at the Battle of al—Qadisiyyah (some date it in 635 or 636)
638 Muslim Crusaders conquer and annex Jerusalem, taking it from the Byzantines.
638—650 Muslim Crusaders conquer Iran, except along Caspian Sea.
639—642 Muslim Crusaders conquer Egypt.
641 Muslim Crusaders control Syria and Palestine.
643—707 Muslim Crusaders conquer North Africa.
644 Caliph Umar is assassinated by a Persian prisoner of war; Uthman ibn Affan is elected third Caliph, who is regarded by many Muslims as gentler than Umar.
644—650 Muslim Crusaders conquer Cyprus, Tripoli in North Africa, and establish Islamic rule in Iran, Afghanistan, and Sind.
656 Caliph Uthman is assassinated by disgruntled Muslim soldiers; Ali ibn Abi Talib, son—in—law and cousin to Muhammad, who married the prophet's daughter Fatima through his first wife Khadija, is set up as Caliph.
656 Battle of the Camel, in which Aisha, Muhammad's wife, leads a rebellion against Ali for not avenging Uthman's assassination. Ali's partisans win.
657 Battle of Siffin between Ali and Muslim governor of Jerusalem, arbitration goes against Ali
661 Murder of Ali by an extremist; Ali's supporters acclaim his son Hasan as next Caliph, but he comes to an agreement with Muawiyyah I and retires to Medina.
661—680 the Caliphate of Muawiyyah I. He founds Umayyid dynasty and moves capital from Medina to Damascus
673—678 Arabs besiege Constantinople, capital of Byzantine Empire
680 Massacre of Hussein (Muhammad's grandson), his family, and his supporters in Karbala, Iraq.
691 Dome of the Rock is completed in Jerusalem, only six decades after Muhammad's death.
705 Abd al—Malik restores Umayyad rule.
710—713 Muslim Crusaders conquer the lower Indus Valley.
711—713 Muslim Crusaders conquer Spain and impose the kingdom of Andalus. This article recounts how Muslims today still grieve over their expulsion 700 years later. They seem to believe that the land belonged to them in the first place.
719 Cordova, Spain, becomes seat of Arab governor
732 The Muslim Crusaders stopped at the Battle of Poitiers; that is, Franks (France) halt Arab advance
749 The Abbasids conquer Kufah and overthrow Umayyids
756 Foundation of Umayyid amirate in Cordova, Spain, setting up an independent kingdom from Abbasids
762 Foundation of Baghdad
785 Foundation of the Great Mosque of Cordova
789 Rise of Idrisid amirs (Muslim Crusaders) in Morocco; foundation of Fez; Christoforos, a Muslim who converted to Christianity, is executed.
800 Autonomous Aghlabid dynasty (Muslim Crusaders) in Tunisia
807 Caliph Harun al—Rashid orders the destruction of non—Muslim prayer houses and of the church of Mary Magdalene in Jerusalem
809 Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sardinia, Italy
813 Christians in Palestine are attacked; many flee the country
831 Muslim Crusaders capture Palermo, Italy; raids in Southern Italy
850 Caliph al—Matawakkil orders the destruction of non—Muslim houses of prayer
855 Revolt of the Christians of Hims (Syria)
837—901 Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sicily, raid Corsica, Italy, France
869—883 Revolt of black slaves in Iraq
909 Rise of the Fatimid Caliphate in Tunisia; these Muslim Crusaders occupy Sicily, Sardinia
928—969 Byzantine military revival, they retake old territories, such as Cyprus (964) and Tarsus (969)
937 The Ikhshid, a particularly harsh Muslim ruler, writes to Emperor Romanus, boasting of his control over the holy places
937 The Church of the Resurrection (known as Church of Holy Sepulcher in Latin West) is burned down by Muslims; more churches in Jerusalem are attacked
960 Conversion of Qarakhanid Turks to Islam
966 Anti—Christian riots in Jerusalem
969 Fatimids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Egypt and found Cairo
c. 970 Seljuks enter conquered Islamic territories from the East
973 Israel and southern Syria are again conquered by the Fatimids
1003 First persecutions by al—Hakim; the Church of St. Mark in Fustat, Egypt, is destroyed
1009 Destruction of the Church of the Resurrection by al—Hakim (see 937)
1012 Beginning of al—Hakim's oppressive decrees against Jews and Christians
1015 Earthquake in Palestine; the dome of the Dome of the Rock collapses
1031 Collapse of Umayyid Caliphate and establishment of 15 minor independent dynasties throughout Muslim Andalus
1048 Reconstruction of the Church of the Resurrection completed
1050 Creation of Almoravid (Muslim Crusaders) movement in Mauretania; Almoravids (aka Murabitun) are coalition of western Saharan Berbers; followers of Islam, focusing on the Quran, the hadith, and Maliki law.
1055 Seljuk Prince Tughrul enters Baghdad, consolidation of the Seljuk Sultanate
1055 Confiscation of property of Church of the Resurrection
1071 Battle of Manzikert, Seljuk Turks (Muslim Crusaders) defeat Byzantines and occupy much of Anatolia
1071 Turks (Muslim Crusaders) invade Palestine
1073 Conquest of Jerusalem by Turks (Muslim Crusaders)
1075 Seljuks (Muslim Crusaders) capture Nicea (Iznik) and make it their capital in Anatolia
1076 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) conquer western Ghana
1085 Toledo is taken back by Christian armies
1086 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) send help to Andalus, Battle of Zallaca
1090—1091 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) occupy all of Andalus except Saragossa and Balearic Islands
1094 Byzantine emperor Alexius Comnenus I asks western Christendom for help against Seljuk invasions of his territory; Seljuks are Muslim Turkish family of eastern origins; see 970
1095 Pope Urban II preaches first Crusade; they capture Jerusalem in 1099

So it is only after all of the Islamic aggressive invasions that Western Christendom launches its first Crusades.

[MissionMan]

And this is really really really incorrect.

<snip>

I'm confused. Are you saying the Muslims created Canon?

[ricktas]

I'm confused. Are you saying the Muslims created Canon?

We could tell you, but we would have to charge you a $0.10 Canon tax.

[MissionMan]

We could tell you, but we would have to charge you a $0.10 Canon tax.

On a more serious note, I could never use Canon due to racism. I had a friend who wasn't allowed to join the Canon Professional Services because he was jewish.

They told him it was because he was circumsized. Apparently you have to be a complete prick to be a Canon user

Now I think I'll leave because I think this will start world war 3.

[ameerat42]

Relax! There's nothing to worry about. That reference to Terrorist Threads was just a new clothing store opening.

[Mark L]

That reference to Terrorist Threads was just a new clothing store opening.

Well since it's my terrorist thread, I hope Terrorist Threads pay me a better CommisionMan than Nikon do.

[ameerat42]

Nick on? I've been told to Nick off at times.

I reckon it all depends on which side of the bed one gets out of.

Now some beds are hard up against a wall, and when you try to get out on the "wrong" side...!
Well, they don't call it a Harvey Wallbanger for nothing.

So next time you're at Harvey's I suggest you look out for an "each-way bed".
I reckon if you have an "each-way bed" it won't matter what side you get out of.

That would have to be the ultimate cure for sore-headedness.

If anybody scoffs at this when you might mention it, don't think it's odds. Ask them if they want a bed!

Am.

Think I'm mad? Try reading this thread!

[Mark L]

I reckon if you have an "each-way bed" it won't matter what side you get out of.

Gives you two options if you need to escape a threat.

And I've not heard of to many people pushing for any sort of sharia law to be included in our legal system. Those few that do are rightly ignored. Just mentioned that as it's been raised in this thread.
It, and a lot what's been written above, doesn't have much to do with you feeling threatened by terrorists in Australia.
Feeling threatened by the Islamic faith also should not have much to do with feeling threatened by terrorists in Australia. But it does.

[ApolloLXII]

So, at the end of the great Nikon/Pentax/Canon war, Sony will be the only one left standing because us users are largely ignored and not considered a threat

[MissionMan]

So, at the end of the great Nikon/Pentax/Canon war, Sony will be the only one left standing because us users are largely ignored and not considered a threat

For now, but Samsung is the ISIS of the camera world. They copy indiscriminately and slowly picking up disillusioned camera users and one day Sony will have to join NATO when they start copying Sony as well. This war isn't over. It's only just beginning. Sony will only see the true evil when Samsung users behead their old DSLR's in the streets.

[ameerat42]

Gives you two options if you need to escape a threat.

And I've not heard of to many people pushing for any sort of sharia law to be included in our legal system. Those few that do are rightly ignored. Just mentioned that as it's been raised in this thread.
It, and a lot what's been written above, doesn't have much to do with you feeling threatened by terrorists in Australia.
Feeling threatened by the Islamic faith also should not have much to do with feeling threatened by terrorists in Australia. But it does.

Just "fought" I'd say "fanx" for the "fread", Mark It did tend to wander around the tropics some!! - Ie, off toppick!

[ricktas]

I wonder if today's events have made anyone consider a change to the way they voted in this poll?

[MissionMan]

I was going to ask the same question

[Duane Pipe]

Those of us that live in major cities or large suburban areas should watch their backs I rekon.
I would hate to read that an Ozzie had their throat cut while going about their daily life..

Remember This.
On 4 December 2005, a group of volunteer surf lifesavers were assaulted by a group of young men of Middle Eastern appearance, with several other violent assaults occurring over the next week.

Remember the British solderer that had his throat cut

It is possible that it could happen, if it dose I hope our security can handle the fallout.

http://www.news.com.au/national/aust...-1227062204389

My scare factor has gone up 1 notch.

[aussie girl]

I feel that there are a few minority groups (some possibly Australian born) who would go to any length to get their message across. A key example of what can happen is the appalling and horrific beheading of the soldier in London, by an English born Muslim. It can certainly happen here - let's hope it never doesn't!!! And don't forget those photos of an Australian born Muslim's son holding up the severed head of some poor person
What concerns me a lot is the fact that the majority of the Muslim society who live here are not seen out in the streets protesting about what is happening overseas. There have been no Imam led protests in our streets in regard to the beheading of 3 innocent people, 2 journalists and one humanitarian worker. Not a whisper!! yet today, after Federal police raided certain Muslim homes, there was a protest in our streets about the invasion of women and children in their own homes. It is believed that some of those arrested where people who were involved in a previous terrorist plot, and it was reported on the news tonight, by the federal court judge, that in the last raid, a vast amount of explosives and chemicals were never recovered.

Look back at history. The German people stayed silent when Hitler started his rants and raves and before long they got to the stage where they were involved in reporting innocent people, Jew and German alike, to save themselves from suspicion.
There was a recent clip on YouTube that summed up this "willingness to do nothing" I have put the link below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAoXgZLRee0

What I get annoyed about is the way that Muslim people have to introduce themselves as a Muslim. You don't hear many people say, "as an Australian Christian" do you? and I cannot ever condone those who want "Sharia Law" put in place for "their" people. Why would you flee a country because of war and strife only to try to change a new country to be just like the country you fled? I have nothing against Muslims as such, and I am sure there are plenty out there who are no different to the average Christian person in our community, but I get very annoyed that this particular religious group are trying to demand changes under the name of Islam. Things like being "offended" by our Christmas celebrations, which has resulted in some shopping centres banning Christmas decorations being put up. In America, some bureaucrats in high places have introduced the saying "Happy Holiday's " instead of Merry Christmas, because they don't want to "offend" another religious group. I find this insulting to OUR cultural beliefs and customs. We are a very multicultural society - we have been bringing in migrants from many different countries over the decades. Greeks, Italians, English, Vietnamese, Phillapinos Sudanese, to mention a few, but I have not known of any of these races demanding to have our lifestyles changed to suit their beliefs. We have Greek Orthodox who hold their religious ceremonies and celebrate their Easter on different days to us, but never have they demanded that Easter be changed to when they celebrate it. You do not hear of Buddhist monks demanding that we change our ways to conform with their religion. Most of them go to their own churches or temples and pray for their own God in their own ways. Too many Muslim groups seem to be hellbent on changing everyone to Islam and getting the laws of the land changed to the Islamic ideology as well and I find that extremely worrying. This clip below is a good example of what is being attempted in Britain This parliamentarian has since been voted out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Knk_jpq7Vx8

[Mark L]

What I get annoyed about is the way that Muslim people have to introduce themselves as a Muslim.

I haven't encountered that?
In fact the Muslim I've met would rather not tell you they are, in our multicultural society.
Do you feel threatened by terrorists?

[MissionMan]

I haven't encountered that?
In fact the Muslim I've met would rather not tell you they are, in our multicultural society.
Do you feel threatened by terrorists?

I have actually seen that oddly enough, it doesn't happen often but they either introduce themselves as Muslim or Australian Muslim. It's a little like someone introducing themselves as an African American. If you were born in america, you're american. The Africa part is part of your roots but there is no need to distinguish yourself. If you do, you can't complain about racial segregation when you introduce yourself in such a way that you are segregated.

I noticed that Belgium has now introduced a system whereby those who go fight for ISIS will lose their citizenship and any future claim to refugee status. It's an interesting approach. I believe the UN says you can't revoke citizenship but if you swear allegiance to another nation, there might be loopholes. I'd be interested to see if others follow suit.

[Mary Anne]

I wonder if today's events have made anyone consider a change to the way they voted in this poll?

No I still feel the same way.. I am not the least worried about terrorists in Australia.

[bobt]

I wonder if today's events have made anyone consider a change to the way they voted in this poll?

Not me! I agree that we cannot afford to be intimidated, and we should not allow religious loonies to change our way of life - BUT, the fact remains that we are not dealing with rational, thoughtful people. What we do have in our midst is a relatively small group of individuals whose actions are not predicated on logical and reasoned arguments but on an ideology that is simply medieval and barbaric. Their thought processes are no more predictable than the Ebola virus as both kill indiscriminately without any rhyme or reason. Just as plagues need to be isolated and contained, so does radicalism. Our society needs to be educated so that radicalism finds nowhere to grow and be nourished, and this process needs to start within the Islamic community.