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Thread: Were Fuji being blatantly cheeky ---

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    Moderately Underexposed I @ M's Avatar
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    Were Fuji being blatantly cheeky ---

    --- when they sent out emails yesterday announcing the X-T1?

    I seem to remember another camera company using a similar phrase recently to herald their "new" model.


    PS, it is all in the first line of the header.
    Andrew
    Nikon, Fuji, Nikkor, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina and too many other bits and pieces to list.



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    A royal pain in the bum! arthurking83's Avatar
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    Purity only in BS!

    and FWIW: so is/was the marketing garb on the Df.

    it seems as though purity in the craft of capturing photography is more about how small the camera is or how the controls are laid out .... as opposed to the actual craft itself.

    has it not yet dawned on anyone that purity in photographing anything originally involved a massively sized wooden box which was almost impossible to lug around by a single person(mainly carried by pack animals of some type), with annoyingly complicated glass or metal plates, causing death or serious injury in many instances(the poisonous chemicals) .. took hours to capture a simple rendering, cost a fortune to indulge in ...

    Seriously, do we really want to go back to the purity of photography?

    I really wish someone of stature would stand up and fight this marketing guff.
    It actually takes away a fair amount of interest in the gear pushed as such in my mind.
    Nikon D800E, D300, D70s
    {Nikon} -> 50/1.2 : 500/8(CPU'd) : 105/2.8VR Micro : 180/2.8ais : 105mm f/1.8ais : 24mm/2ais
    {Sigma}; ->10-20/4-5.6 : 50/1.4 : 12-24/4.5-5.6II : 150-600mm|S
    {Tamron}; -> 17-50/2.8 : 28-75/2.8 : 70-200/2.8 : 300/2.8 SP MF : 24-70/2.8VC


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    AK, surely it is pure marketing to be the retro of the pack?
    After all isn't it the marketing dept. that determines the product that the public really want and are the major force in any decisions?

    May the force be with you.

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    A royal pain in the bum! arthurking83's Avatar
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    Did you mean ..


    may the pure be forced upon you ... again!


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    Administrator ricktas's Avatar
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    Ah yes Purity...as opposed to punity!

    Retro is all the rage and they are just adding to the game. It is surprising that these pure cameras do not offer such wonderful in-camera functions to allow instagram like effects, or lomographic effects, that try and emulate the purity of the past... you know the lightleak, or the wacko contrast results, perhaps a velvia button?

    Though I do like these new fangled things that go supposedly back to basics and let me take control of what I shoot. Cause my D3 and D800 do not do that... oh wait... what is this button called M all about?

    It has a sensor, it has a shutter, it can take pixures... WOW, it must be Pure!

    I do actually like these retro designs and think they look COOL, but the marketing people need to come up with something new.
    "It is one thing to make a picture of what a person looks like, it is another thing to make a portrait of who they are" - Paul Caponigro

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    A royal pain in the bum! arthurking83's Avatar
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    Actually two points of interest to be aware of with respect to the use of the term pure whateveray

    the Df went pure in that it's all about photography, and leaning heavily on it's ability to mount to almost all of it's legacy lenses without too much difficulty or imposition(of course some old lenses will be hard if not impossible to mount anyhow).
    But it did away with 'useless' fripperies such as video(which I thought is stupid actually!) and didn't add new ones like .. WiFi!! and instant connectivity!!

    I'm guessing that Wifi and connectivity is a traditional olde worlde feature from cameras of the 1800's then?

    y'know .. why mess about with chemically treating fragile glass plates when you can instantly upload that in camera HDR image via WiFi from the Antarctic region whilst stuck in a hopeless ice freeze?

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    Administrator ricktas's Avatar
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    Perhaps we should survey the Russians on how many Df's were on-board the recently stuck (and ultimately rescued) ship down that-a-way?

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    The whole ROMANTIC, RETRO Idea of trying to get back to basics in it's self is fine but to me that is not what it is all about.
    Unfortunately it's all about the almighty $$$$$$ and keeping the wheels of industry that have been created going, keeping control of the market, the shareholder and themselves in a job.

    As with software the continual and unnecessary changing and so called upgrades that keep us having to change equipment.
    the upgrades or additions are fine but having to change the main platform and controlling companies so that certain software packages can't be used on other software without emulator software is ridiculous.

    I know I'm being idealistic and simplistic. from what I'm reading into this as I've not really looked into it as such, if the companies want to create these things then go the whole hog and do it properly instead of these half baked ideas that don't do it properly including aperture rings on lenses.

    Or maybe they are just lost and don't know where to go next.

    Naaa. I think I'll just go grab me camera and take some photos WITH ME NEW 24-70 heee heee heee.
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    Ausphotography Regular swifty's Avatar
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    I kinda wonder whether something got lost in translation.
    By 'Pure' photography, did they really mean 'Purely' photography.
    As in, not the opposite of impure but meaning 'only' and excluding videography?
    This is referencing the original Nikon Df campaign of course.

    Clearly Fuji's ribbing Nikon's efforts. I would too cos I think Fuji's come up with a better 'fusion'. The word fusion's in bold in the first paragraph too LOL.

    Reminds me of the funny advertisement battles between some of the car manufacturers, especially BMW and Audi.
    Last edited by swifty; 17-02-2014 at 12:31pm.
    Nikon FX

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    Quote Originally Posted by ROA44 View Post
    The whole ROMANTIC, RETRO Idea of trying to get back to basics in it's self is fine but to me that is not what it is all about.
    Unfortunately it's all about the almighty $$$$$$ and keeping the wheels of industry that have been created going, keeping control of the market, the shareholder and themselves in a job.
    Exactly.

    Quote Originally Posted by swifty View Post
    Reminds me of the funny advertisement battles between some of the car manufacturers, especially BMW and Audi.
    Exactly.

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    Not just that, but... "Value from Innovation". That sounds awfully close to "Vorsprung durch Technik" if you ask me...
    Ciao, Joost

    All feedback is highly appreciated!

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    An aperture ring, a shutter speed dial, and an exposure compensation dial. These are the features that attracted me to the Fuji X-E2.

    They are described as retro, but to me they are critical components of the camera, and match "my" method of photo taking. I am so thankful that they have returned.
    For two decades now I have had a constant (though small) annoyance with the controls of my Nikon F801, D70s and finally D7000.

    I was attracted to the Nikon Df, but what a lumbering beast. Fuji have won my heart and my dollars.

    I am now out taking photos far more often, and it feels natural.

    I'm an old bugger, and this style of camera suits me.
    Everyone has different needs. So I suggest, find the camera that fits you, and go for it.

    Now all I want is the viewfinder of an SLR, with the compactness of a mirror-less. Not much to ask for is it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowjac View Post
    An aperture ring, a shutter speed dial, and an exposure compensation dial. These are the features that attracted me to the Fuji X-E2.
    bowjac, as a user of both a Fuji body and multiple Nikon bodies I am failing to see the difference in the controls.

    An aperture ring
    = Fuji, on the lens. Check.
    = Nikon, on the lens or on the body depending on the lens in use and the menu settings. Check.

    A shutter speed dial
    = Fuji, a separate dial that needs to be turned with moving the fingers from a "natural place" . Check.
    = Nikon, a conveniently placed dial under your right thumb that doesn't need moving fingers from a "natural place". Check.

    An exposure compensation dial
    = Fuji, in a place that falls readily to hand thumb but some would argue that it is too easy to move without realising that you have done so unless you are watching closely in the viewfinder. Check
    = Nikon a well located button press and dial turn that can be executed without removing hands or eyes from where they need to be. Or --- customisable in the menus to be by dial only. Check.

    Really it is up to you to determine the style of controls that suit your photography the best but I believe the balance still swings the Nikon way by virtue of the fact that you can either do it the "retro" way or by the 2014 method whereas the Fuji pushes you down the path to last century.

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    A royal pain in the bum! arthurking83's Avatar
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    The dials philosophy is simply a throwback to an earlier period, and IMO, just a retro gimick used to achieve a greater market share.

    As Andrew already said, nothing that is being achieved via these dials, hasn't been improved upon via the elctro-mechanical button/wheelnew era.

    In fast paced situations such as sport(as one example easy to think of) .. do you really think the ergonomics of these retro dials, in place of modern button/wheel, are going to provide a more consistent workflow?
    it's ludicrous to think that is it.
    That's why the vast majority of the modern cameras evolved in the way they did!
    Going back to the old days is not an improvement on anything that can be currently done in most cameras.

    For a quick overview of the settings on your camera nothing comes close(yet) to the top LCD that many cameras have!
    Replacing that with one or two dials for info on one or two aspects of the cameras settings is a major backward step in ergonomics and speed of workflow.
    The ISO and exposure compensation dial give me no indication that the GPS is connected, what file type mode I'm set too, how much battery power remains, is exposure bracketing on, and by how many frames and in which direction.
    Moving any of that sort of info into the EVF is also a major backward step in the evolution of the speedy camera.

    The only ergonomic improvement I'd like to see in my next camera is backlit buttons a la D4. Not that I need it all that often, but every now and then in the dark, it'd be nice to have

    It wont be too long into the future of this craze, where more demand will be placed in those dials to control multiple functions(as they eventually did in some cameras later in the family tree of many camera manufacturers lineups.
    Then the ISO dial will become the ISO/HDR/QUAL/REVIEW dial .. and so on and so forth. Eventually(3 generations later) these same manufacturers will eventually replace those traditional dials with more modern and cheaper to make buttons and wheels and no one will ever notice, other than the improvement in access to the many features!


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    I suppose that a pure photography camera wouldn't do video?

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