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Thanks useful information: 25
Cattle prod, you have not said if you bought tHis from supplier in Australia. If you have, then, immediately lodge an application withe Consumer Trader and Tenancy Tirbunal. There is an office in Liverpool and they have hearings in Campbelltown. the application cost is about $35 but you need to check by calling Liverpool office and talking to them. anything else is a waste of time.
Nikon and Pentax user
Hi Mongo, the body came from Hong Kong, but the company is .com.au and openly publishes the ABN and a Sydney telephone number... It shouldn't be a problem going through CTTT, and my work takes me to the same floor in their building at Liverpool. I can also lodge a dispute with PayPal... I'm just seeing if they are going to come around to a reasonable resolution first. (reasonable for me would be getting a new camera). They sent me a message earlier today telling me they have queried thier supplier, should be interesting to see the response. They haven't been slack with emails and response times either, which I'm glad about.
Cheers, Dave.
I was just about to buy a new D600 and can't talk my local shops to discount at all from $2400+ , so was going to buy from my online "pretty popular" usual supplier.Originally Posted by rpps
Which program did you use to get the D600 exif data serial number.
When you say the serial number on the back, I take it you mean it was written in the blank serial number box on the base plate as per your pic.
Could this uncovered rort also apply to lenses? etc. I remember some years ago a well known computer manufacturer was caught (and fined as I recall) selling refurbished computers as new...
I have a Canon 100mm L macro and on the outside of the box it arrived in, is a printed Canon barcode (looks genuine) showing the serial number. The number matches the serial number on the lens.
My Canon 70-200 L box, (similar designed box) in the same area where the 100mm has a printed Canon barcode has the serial number written in biro. It is the same number etched on the lens.
Initially, the supplier sent me the wrong lens by mistake (sent me the non IS version). I returned it and was sent the correct lens. I had the original 100mm L box and the 70-200 IS replacement boxes side by side when I saw the serial number was written in biro instead of having a printed Canon barcode sticker.
The first thing I thought of was I had been sent a refurbished lens and rang the supplier. He said that it was genuine and new.
Today, I read these posts about dodgy serial numbers and wonder again if I was sent a brand new lens and I was the first person to use it.
I usually don't buy store stock sitting on shelves in shops either, because I know that store staff take them out for a test drive and put them back on the shelves.
Last edited by flashc; 03-12-2012 at 3:38am.
Canon EOS 7D Mk II, Canon 70D, Canon G12, Canon EF-S 15-85mm, EF 70-200 L f4 IS, 580EX II
You get the serial number form the metadata that shows in programs such as Canon digital phot professional, of the Bridge part of photoshop.
I have no idea how you could tell if a lens is new or not. The serial number is of course etched onto the lens somewhere and not able to be changed, unlike the camera number which is printed onto a label whichis then fixed to the camera and therefore liable to be altered.
The age of entitlement isn't over, it's just over there where you can't get to it.
When several possibilities exist, the simplest solution is the best.
"There are no rules" Bruce Barnbaum, The art of Photography
Graham
Here's the latest messages in the saga about my 5D iii...
From them...
28 November 2012 12:31:46 by Customer Support
hi, we are checking with our supplier about your complaint, it's much stronger case when it's canon report rather than a verbal indication..., Responsed by PM Cam-Mike
From me...
3 December 2012 9:44:4 by Dave
It's been nearly 2 weeks since I first raised this issue, if you don't come up with a resolution soon, I will be forced to take further action.
From them...
3 December 2012 12:53:48 by Customer Support
hi dave, we got reply from supplier last friday.
They needed to check with their supplier in Japan hence the time taken.
They replied. "
The Japan supplier told me that since some Canon�s product are not allow export to other country, therefore they may change the serial number label, but this not mean the camera is refurbish or second hand, no one will know this issue, only between Canon and the first supplier."
This is normal practice, as we have seem Sony making similar requests to avoid cross region sales, trading.
There are always difference in pricing by diff canon offices to match local competitive conditions.
Some clever sales staff will look for creative ways to meet sales targets, and part of their special pricing is to sell the items outside their designated region.
, Responsed by PM Cam-Mike
And from me....
3 December 2012 13:32:21 by Dave
Not an acceptable answer. I have bought this item in good faith. The serial numbers do not match. I don't care about the deceptive business practices of your suppliers. I require my purchased camera to have matching numbers, AS IT SHOULD BE FROM THE FACTORY! I require this both for security, in case the camera is stolen and the serial number sticker removed, and for chain-of-evidence and copyright reasons. It's up to you, the seller of the item, to provide me with goods that are fit for the purpose, and clearly the item you sold me is not. The question remaining now is, what are you going to do to rectify the problem?
Stay tuned
Do we have an update Rick? Or any more information? The Trade Practices Act and Consumer Affairs should be notified so as to bring this complaint out into the open. I have not heard any news reports about this. Canon may wish to limit sales from overseas re pricing but we do have laws? Is it limited to any one supplier? I doubt it as grey market camera gear is readily available from any number of shops. I feel for those caught up in this as it leaves a bitter taste behind however it maybe that you do have a new product anyway. JMHO cheers Brian
PS It has stopped me from purchasing anything grey for the time being until this type of thing is sorted......
Cheers Brian.
Canon 7D Kit lenses EFS 18-55 IS EFS 55-250 IS EF28-90 Canon EF 2xll Extender Sigma DG150-500 OS Speedlight 420EX. 580EX
Threadstarter
This is outside Fair Trading in most instances as the products are being shipped in from Overseas, and the financial transaction is often not even done in Australia. The issue is not related to one particular grey marketer. The changing of the serial numbers appears to have been done by Canon Hong Kong, not the grey marketers. Canon Hong Kong apparently have a contract with Canon that has several clauses about who they can sell to. This simply appears to be a way of trying to get round those contractual agreement clauses. Canon would have a record of what serial numbers it sold to Canon Hong Kong, thus if any of the gear ends up in grey marketers hands, Canon had proof that Canon Hong Kong were breaching their contract. So Canon Hong Kong decided to 'amend' the serial numbers to stop Canon tracking the items. But they obviously were not very smart about it, cause they forgot that the serial number is embedded in the firmware as well.
I would like to see Canon come out and make a statement re this matter, and what action they intend to take against Canon Hong Kong. But nothing is forthcoming at present.
Remember the grey marketers sold these cameras in good faith, they did not know that Canon Hong Kong were manipulating the serial numbers until it came to light recently. So the grey marketers are stuck in the middle here, I reckon they are all trying to get recourse from Canon Hong Kong over this.
The thing to note is that the camera is not fake, just the serial number on the body. The camera should work perfectly well. The issue arises when one of these cameras needs to be repaired and Canon will refuse due to the counterfeit serial number. Replacement of the serial number plate with one that matches the FW embedded serial number seems to be the way ahead. After all the camera is not fake, just the plate. It appears the plate was altered for one purpose, to try and get round a contractual agreement, nothing more. Canon will fix the cameras as long as the serial number on the plate and the one in the FW match.
Last edited by ricktas; 04-12-2012 at 8:15am.
"It is one thing to make a picture of what a person looks like, it is another thing to make a portrait of who they are" - Paul Caponigro
Constructive Critique of my photographs is always appreciated
Nikon, etc!
RICK
My Photography
This is very worrying re grey imports, hence why it's a grey area
Last edited by nisstrust; 04-12-2012 at 12:02pm.
"Knowledge is a single point, but the ignorant have multiplied it."
Okay folks,
The supplier has decided to replace my camera. They have given me a RA number, and even an office address in Sydney I can drop it off at...
It took a while, but I'm happy with that result. Suffice to say, when the new body arrives, I'll be very carefully checking the numbers on it!!!
Threadstarter
Great result. I would open the new camersa and check the serial numbers before leaving their store!
I'm just going to post it in to them, Rick. I'm way too busy at this time of year to make a special trip just to drop off the camera... But I have noted their address, just in case the new body needs to be inserted somewhere
oh my, having read all these issues about contradicting serial numbers between the camera body and the EXIF file, i hope the AP site sponsors are selling legit cameras and camera accessories.
Threadstarter
As pointed out repeatedly, the retailers are not the ones at fault here. Canon Hong Kong altered the serial number plates BEFORE supplying them to the market.oh my, having read all these issues about contradicting serial numbers between the camera body and the EXIF file, i hope the AP site sponsors are selling legit cameras and camera accessories.
Last edited by ricktas; 07-12-2012 at 11:41pm.
Great information
I have had my case about a non genuine serial number on my D600 settled, with the help of PayPal. The total amount of just over $2000 was refunded to my account.
*I have edited your post and removed the reference to the company involved. As repeatedly stated in this thread, the retailers were not the ones changing the serial numbers, it was Canon Hong Kong, and thus the retailers had no idea until it was discovered, and therefore it is not their fault, so naming them achieves nothing : admin*
Last edited by ricktas; 21-12-2012 at 8:18am.
So this is now effecting Nikon as well?? Thought it was a Canon only problem.
Cheers,
Ian
All the 7's: D700, D7000, D70
D600 (Nikon) or 600D (Canon) ?????
Last edited by Kym; 21-12-2012 at 1:38pm.
I am subscribed to this thread and hence receive emails for every post. He specifically mentions Nikon in the edited section.
Threadstarter
It would seem that Nikon suppliers are not immune to this either. My guess is that it has been a rort through HK for some time
Putting aside the specific cases mentioned, the whole issue of grey market economics goes back to the pricing policies of the manufacturers. I've long marvelled at how grey market retailers could sell genuine (and they are genuine) products so much cheaper than the official retail channels in Australia. I've been shown the wholesale prices that one very large retailer pays, and it is above the retail price I've paid to B&H (for one example). The gear was genuine and had to be coming from official Canon sources somehow.
The manufacturers, and the wholesalers, are just enforcing a cost upon the consumer here that would seem to NOT apply to those wholesalers in other countries. Unless all those foreign wholesalers/importers are selling below cost because they like aussies, what other explanation can there be? The need to change serial numbers to disguise the source says a little something about the manufacturers as well as the person doing the swapping. If there was a uniform wholesale price for all importers/wholesalers internationally (with the allowance for differences in freight and taxes) then we would be able to assume that differences in retail pricing would be as a result of genuine retail chain expenses rather than simple price-gouging.
The refusal to service gear, even at the owner's expense, doesn't appear to be a problem for most grey buyers such as myself. I've had several repairs done on Grey gear by Canon Australia, and one of those was even done for free when the camera was well out of warranty. Thank you Canon Australia for that. The dodgy labels obviously caused the UK importer to suspect that maybe more than the label was counterfeit. It would be pretty easy for them to track down the supplier though. I'm betting they even know by now which serial numbers (genuine) were rebadged.
This won't deter me from sourcing gear from wherever I get the best deal.
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