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View Full Version : POLL: Would you buy a grey market body ??



bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 4:19pm
Today I found out the new Sony A850 will retail for $3499 when it arrives in a few weeks time. After doing a little snooping around and discovering I will be able to pick it up for about $2500 grey market .. It got me wondering how many of you would buy a substantial item like a FF body on the grey market ?? At the end of the day, its a lot of money to risk, but its also a lot of money to save too ..

kiwi
14-09-2009, 4:20pm
I bought my D3 that way, so, yeah, I have and would again

Paul G
14-09-2009, 4:46pm
I don't get the whole 'grey-market' thing...

If it's so taboo why dont the big company's put a stop to it.

Aren't these grey market products made by the companies in question anyway or are they knock-offs?

rollingstone
14-09-2009, 4:55pm
Canon have tried to stop it by refusing warranty claims on cameras not bought in Australia but there are ways around this. My 50D came from DigitalRev on EBay but it does have a warranty which is able to be exercised in Australia. Extended warranties can also be bought here.

I saved about $300-$400 dollars.

Kym
14-09-2009, 4:59pm
Voted no - you need maybe and candy options.

Maybe ... the K-7 was local but I got a good price <5% on grey - so local was worth it.

But if I were 20% or more better off I might go grey.

davidd
14-09-2009, 5:01pm
I don't get the whole 'grey-market' thing...

If it's so taboo why dont the big company's put a stop to it.

Aren't these grey market products made by the companies in question anyway or are they knock-offs?

Hi

yes, they are genuine articles, they are just imported by non-authorised dealers. There can be problems in getting them serviced or repaired. I have bought grey market lenses, but I'd rather get a camera body from the authorised importer.

I @ M
14-09-2009, 5:03pm
I don't get the whole 'grey-market' thing...

If it's so taboo why dont the big company's put a stop to it.

Aren't these grey market products made by the companies in question anyway or are they knock-offs?

The "local" distributors, here, USA, Europe, etc. etc. would love to see parallel imported cameras stopped but to the manufacturers and more importantly the share holders of the companies, a camera sold is a camera sold, they get their profit margin irrespective of how the unit reaches the consumer. :rolleyes:

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 5:06pm
I don't get the whole 'grey-market' thing...

If it's so taboo why dont the big company's put a stop to it.

Aren't these grey market products made by the companies in question anyway or are they knock-offs?

I dont think its taboo at all .. I just think that when buying something of much more worth like a body, or top grade glass, you need to weigh up whether the cash saving is worth having less peace of mind in terms of warranty if something should go wrong .. for less expensive items its less of a gamble with less to lose but bodies are big money, particularly FF bodies.

My situation is simple, I can save $1000 now, which is 30% if the RRP of the camera .. a significant saving. And the particular importer im considering buying from has a service agent in Australia that deals with all their warranty claims, which is a big plus.

Kym
14-09-2009, 5:08pm
C R Kennedy will match Sigma grey imports...

http://www.crkennedy.com.au/v1/index.cfm?pageID=465

old dog
14-09-2009, 5:12pm
sounds to me like it`s worthwhile Darren. I think I would go for it. My next body, if not bought 2nd hand on fleabay, will be grey market and hopefully a rep company like the one you are going to buy through. I wouldn`t buy from OS, HK, etc.

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 5:12pm
C R Kennedy will match Sigma grey imports...

http://www.crkennedy.com.au/v1/index.cfm?pageID=465

thats interesting Kym. Maybe I was just unlucky.

Way back when when i bought my 10-20 I called tham and asked them if they would match the price from DigtialRev because Id prefer to buy local if possible but without being out of pocket .. no-one returned my call.

I ended up buying the lens at Canera House because I got a very good deal in the end ...

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 5:14pm
I wouldn`t buy from OS, HK, etc.

These guys are OZ based but all their stock is HK stock. Its worth mentioning ive bought lenses from them before and have no problems whatsoever.

ricktas
14-09-2009, 5:20pm
Once the warranty period (12 months usually) is over, there is no difference in the cost of repairs etc. I voted Yes.

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 5:27pm
Once the warranty period (12 months usually) is over, there is no difference in the cost of repairs etc. I voted Yes.

I agree with that too Rick ... so you just gotta cross your fingers it stays good for that initial warranty period. But in saying that, a few weeks back I would have been toast with a grey market body. My camera s%^&t itself on a shoot. I took it to Progear in Sydney, Sonys authorised repairer, with a few days of warranty left. If it had have been an import it would have cost me $60 just to drop it off, and then god knows how much to fix ( repairs were a replacement AF module and a replacement Aperture module :eek:)

So this little experience is whats got me thinking about which way to go ...

Lani
14-09-2009, 5:31pm
I voted yes because I have done and will again, especially if the $AU is strong. You could get a lot of repairs done for $1000....and like you said it still comes with a warranty anyway.
Ultimately although it is a bit of a punt especially if you haven't tested their warranty out, it makes an option you would be silly to disregard, as the savings make it worthwhile....and isn't life all about taking informed chances. ;)

ye have just had a brush with frame and a bird be whistling at ye. Strut yer stuff in th' bush

ricktas
14-09-2009, 5:32pm
Hi

There can be problems in getting them serviced or repaired. I have bought grey market lenses, but I'd rather get a camera body from the authorised importer.

Both Canon and Nikon in Australia have stated they will repair grey market cameras without any issues.

The owners will just have to pay for any repairs. And once the 12 month warranty is over, so do the owners who bought their camera through Australian suppliers. A warrantly only covers manufacturing defects, so any damage etc caused by an owner, is treated and repaired exactly the same, whether the item is Australian distributed or grey market.

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 5:40pm
it makes an option you would be silly to disregard, as the savings make it worthwhile....and isn't life all about taking informed chances. ;)

Absolutely Lani .. and the reality is I probably will end up buying it considering they just emailed me about 5 seconds ago telling me they have it in stock ready to ship :D

Redgum
14-09-2009, 5:52pm
I simply agreed with Rick and others and said yes. Those with a legitimate business have another option and that is insurance. Loss anywhere in the world, accidental damage, loss of profit etc., are all there for professionals and when you have a lot of gear and travel commercially insurance is essential.
When it comes to high end video cameras I won't touch the grey market because it would destroy employment and opportunity in a market which is a great deal smaller than the camera market employment wise. One day that may change. Just a personal choice.

Darvidanoar
14-09-2009, 5:59pm
As stated before, after 12 months, a grey market item will cost just the same to repair as an aus item. If the saving seems worth the risk, then why not?

However, I might add that I would probably not go as far as ordering one thru an ebay shop run out of the middle empire. A local grey importer with a good rep, like discount digital would be my pref. :)

N*A*M
14-09-2009, 6:27pm
i bought my d80 from singapore and d300 from malaysia
even cheaper than australian fronted grey retailers because you're paying in local currency

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 6:29pm
wonder if i should wait six months and buy it in Bangkok in Feb ?? mmmm .....

I @ M
14-09-2009, 6:35pm
wonder if i should wait six months and buy it in Bangkok in Feb ?? mmmm .....

Errr, think customs, GST, fees and possible fines.:eek:

davesmith
14-09-2009, 6:37pm
I got my a700 grey back when the $ was almost 1:1. Mind you, I felt a lot more comfortable about the deal being able to walk into to the shop (DDP) to collect it together with their support, rather than waiting for it to ship from overseas.

The $ is starting to look good again and if I were ready for another body now I'd take advantage of it again.

mbong
14-09-2009, 7:03pm
I bought my body D300 from grey market, I would not hesitate to do it again as long as its from reputable shop like D-D-Photographics and of course if price difference is huge (i.e more than $300).

Redgum
14-09-2009, 7:30pm
A point of caution though. Remember anything over $A1000 you will have to pay the equivalent of GST of 10% and you can't get around this because everything goes through customs. Two, it is possible for other import charges to be applied above and beyond the 10% and you won't know until it arrives. If the overseas merchant doesn't/won't provide the proper documentation the cost could be prohibitive, so high in fact it could be cheaper to leave the goods with customs. Finally, make sure you get the right documentation with the goods or the police could call to repossess.
Why I'm emphasising good documentation is that if the camera needs to go back overseas for any reason proof of ownership is the only way to get it back in the country without paying again.

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 7:42pm
nah i think ill go with the importer here .. just got a quote for $2500 delivered ..

etherial
14-09-2009, 9:04pm
nah i think ill go with the importer here .. just got a quote for $2500 delivered ..

Gee your backing up quickly after the CS4 splurge, hope you've got something lined up for Bella!

bigdazzler
14-09-2009, 9:16pm
Gee your backing up quickly after the CS4 splurge, hope you've got something lined up for Bella!

might need an engagement ring to get outta this one .... :eek:

seastorm
14-09-2009, 11:00pm
I voted Yes, as most of you already pointed out, after 1 year the Aust. warranty will be void anyway. With most electronics, if it doesn't stuff up within 1 month of use, it'll be fine..... :D

landteacher
14-09-2009, 11:37pm
Yes for me. D200-local dealer, 2wks out of warranty flash card went $350.00 + $40.00 post, grey market (HK) D60, D90 and various lenses, no hassles & no problems yet. Luck of the draw i guess. PS. One week delivery (100klm) Aus post, 3 days from HK.

EVERYTHING NIKON. SECOND PLACE IS FIRST LOSER.

landteacher
14-09-2009, 11:51pm
might need an engagement ring to get outta this one .... :eek:

You young blokes have no logic! You think that will get you out of it, it's just the start of all your trouble:confused013.

Mick.G.

arthurking83
15-09-2009, 12:05am
You young blokes have no logic! You think that will get you out of it, it's just the start of all your trouble:confused013.

Mick.G.

it's not really the start of your trouble(that started way earlier when he got into photography.. whilst in a relationship with a non photography girl :rolleyes:), although I can fully understand that parallel too, but I see more like:

...... 'the start of the end'!!

I voted yes too. for the right price difference(as per Darrens' quoted prices) it'd have to be a resounding yes too!

I remember Fabian quoted a great price on the D700.. @ only a couple of hundred more than a Grey Market item.
I don't use any % rule, as such... more like a set price difference rule. A $200 saving may not be worth the hassle, but a $500 saving may certainly be!.. somewhere in between is a grey zone.. anything over $500 saving is a dead certainty(for the Grey market item).

make hay while the sun is shining.. and when you present the ring to Bella, make sure you spend up big on all those absolutely necessary wedding items ;)

After all, what significance would your wedding have without a CZ 135/1.8 on a FF body Darren?
(I'm perfectly open to any offers to come to Sydney for the purpose of helping your newly acquired camera gear take photos of your wedding Daz!) :D

ricktas
15-09-2009, 6:17am
might need an engagement ring to get outta this one .... :eek:

lets have a poll on this one!:eek:

kiwi
15-09-2009, 11:34am
I'll do the wedding, charge $500 for a shoot and burn, do the whole thing on one camera, one battery, one 4gb memory card, use a stofen diffuser, edit the photos using Picassa (mainly auto levels), on my uncalibrated monitor

Fantastic !!!

Oh hang on, I don't "do" weddings, dang

NGP
15-09-2009, 3:37pm
well depends if it is going to be cheaper or not.. after the change of the AU$ mid last year, bodies and some lenses were cheaper bought local then imported... in that case buying import doesn't make any sense.. but if you do get it quite a bit cheaper it is worth buying import (taken in consideration of added GST, custom fees and possible credit card currency conversion surcharges) when ordered from overseas.. but if something goes wrong you might have to send it overseas to get it repaired unless you want to pay for it yourself to get it done locally.

we still supply extended international warranties with our imported cameras and lenses we occasionally have on special, so the benefit can be greater then some local stock.

ving
15-09-2009, 4:45pm
gravy please...

mikew09
15-09-2009, 8:38pm
Hi Darren,
I had a very similar post a little while ago and gave this a lot of thought. I would be prepared to risk up 1500 on a lens from a reputable dealer after comments from member that have used them. I don't have much cash to through around on my hobby so do a lot of deliberation over a purchase. I am a marked man in the city camera shots as I get very #### in bartering and I have actually seen a shop assistant avoid me :-). Purchased a Canon 430 EX II Speedlight on Monday and bargained them down to $380 and through in a set of energisers to boot. Still not a gray dealer price but considering the margin was happy with the purchase. To the point, I find if you are prepared to push the local dealers really hard it is surprising how much money can be saved.

DAdeGroot
16-09-2009, 7:00pm
I have not read the whole thread, but I voted No. Why ? Because eventually I'll take out CPS (Canon Professional Services) and thus need to buy my bodies from a registered Canon dealer to be eligible. Also at the time, I got my 5DII for a better price for local Aus. stock than grey market, which helped somewhat.

gw.toad
19-09-2009, 9:29pm
I've bought 3 grey cams arrrrr...First from ebay [didgital rev] Fuji s5000 [no probs] second from ebay [forget the dealer] was a Nikon d50 [no probs] and my third was a d300 from[ http://www.d-d-photographics.com.au/index.htm ] {no probs] arrrr....

Yes I would buy grey again arrrrr....

GW.Toad

ajmcphie
19-09-2009, 9:36pm
I recently bought my first camera from one of these sites and ended up saving $300 or more on the RRP... And it was all 100% legit, also it only took a week to arrive from Hong Kong..so I was pretty chuffed .. :p though the total price of purchase was $410, so it is slightly different to spending a few grand, though after making this cheaper purchase I now know that I would confidently buy something considerably dearer from this site (Digital World International - btw )

Hope this helps!

EDIT: Also Full Warrenty came with purchase and I dont have to send my camera overseas if it needs fixing, just to mainland Australia!

Psycronic
20-09-2009, 5:19pm
if it cost less taking taxes etc into account, most definitely (reputable dealers only though). Quite a few of them also offer international warranties (eg Mack)

Redgum
28-09-2009, 9:10am
What is an "International" warranty? I know with some companies that means RTB (Return to Base) for repair which can be prohibitive cost wise and a challenge with customs. If you're unfortunate enough to need this, is it worth it?

Steve Axford
28-09-2009, 9:33am
What is an "International" warranty? I know with some companies that means RTB (Return to Base) for repair which can be prohibitive cost wise and a challenge with customs. If you're unfortunate enough to need this, is it worth it?
It means a warranty not by the original manufacturer i.e. probably not as good. If you buy it overseas you may have to return it to the country of origin (as in the case of an "international" warranty on lenses with B&H - but you can buy the USA versions which have a manufacturer warranty). I think you have to weigh up the saving. If it is high, then it is probably worth it.

Paper_Mache_Man
28-09-2009, 10:09am
Yes, totally and the more expensive the item is the more inclined I'll be to get a grey import.

There are numerous retailers that will provide warranty on grey items. There are also some Oz distributors willing to match grey import prices. I'd try the latter first and then go full grey 2nd.

Steve Axford
28-09-2009, 10:16am
It seems to vary a lot, PMC. Some items are just as cheap in Oz, but some are way more expensive. I think it depends on demand with the less usually items tending to be overpriced here, but it doesn't always work that way. I'm with you though - get them locally if you can, if not grey is ok.

Redgum
28-09-2009, 10:24am
I did a comprehensive article for Australian Video Camera magazine about three years ago on "international warranties". Like any other insurance you get what you pay for and in most cases that was very little. There were a high percentage of "withholds" where the supplier withheld the return of your camera until payment was made, claiming the repair was outside warranty. Often, this payment and freight was just as expensive as the original purchase.
Most punters had no legal recourse for overseas purchase.
So if international warranty is offered you should factor in this loss at time of original purchase. We found that in the majority of cases the warranty was less than beneficial. (Much the same as third party car warranty on a second hand car).
And quite frankly, this is where the margin is for grey importers.

Paper_Mache_Man
28-09-2009, 10:38am
It seems to vary a lot, PMC. Some items are just as cheap in Oz, but some are way more expensive. I think it depends on demand with the less usually items tending to be overpriced here, but it doesn't always work that way. I'm with you though - get them locally if you can, if not grey is ok.

Yeah totally, some items just don't work out cheaper and in some cases it's not possible to get good local warranty in which case the cost of having to send it back to Mars/Venus may outweigh the initial saving.

It's always going to come down to a value judgement. The main thing I'd stress is to be aware of greys as a viable option and not reject it just because 'its grey'.

My only experience is with my 450D. I purchased it from B&H. They had a 14/30 day defective return/exchange policy. Once this had expired I discovered a hot pixel that shows at very slow (1/10) shutter speeds at 1600ISO. If I had local warranty I could get it fixed for free (I think). However for the drama it would cause to send it over to Canon US via a mate it's not worth getting fixed.

Am I unhappy that I bought it from there though? Hell no! I think I saved around $400 at the time when I bought it...that's the cost of a good 2nd hand lens or a new prime or flash.

So yeah...just weigh up the options.

The only thing I will say is that you're far more likely to run into warranty issues on a body than you are with any other camera equipment. To me that's a moot point though as most bodies only come with 1 year. I'd imagine with the top models this would actually matter though (where longer warranty is offered?).

Oh and of course, just because they say they will cover it you're still going to have to deal with the actual service.

I am still trying to get a working LCD from DELL which I bought a year ago. So far they've managed to send me a refurb with a big scratch on it despite promising a new boxed package. So yeah...there's always the chance the warranty wont be worth the paper it's written on lol!

Steve Axford
28-09-2009, 10:54am
I did a comprehensive article for Australian Video Camera magazine about three years ago on "international warranties". Like any other insurance you get what you pay for and in most cases that was very little. There were a high percentage of "withholds" where the supplier withheld the return of your camera until payment was made, claiming the repair was outside warranty. Often, this payment and freight was just as expensive as the original purchase.
Most punters had no legal recourse for overseas purchase.
So if international warranty is offered you should factor in this loss at time of original purchase. We found that in the majority of cases the warranty was less than beneficial. (Much the same as third party car warranty on a second hand car).
And quite frankly, this is where the margin is for grey importers.
For myself, I tend to count an international warranty as being worthless. So, the item has to be good value even without the warranty. Camera bodies seem to be the main problem area as Canon will not warranty a camera body purchased outside Australia, so I buy them here as they really aren't much more expensive if you shop around. Lenses, on the other hand, can be much cheaper and are less likely to break. Also, Canon (sorry I don't know the other brands) do warranty lenses bought overseas, so you don't even have to buy grey. I've only ever bought a few grey items, but that was some years ago when it was worth it (30% off!!!!). I do, however buy a lot of lenses form OS, usually from B&H, but all come with the manufacturers warranty. So I guess, I'm agreeing. Why bother to buy grey nowdays when it costs little extra to buy the warrantied item. But, if the grey item is sufficiently cheap then go for it and accept the loss of warranty.

Paper_Mache_Man
28-09-2009, 12:27pm
For myself, I tend to count an international warranty as being worthless. So, the item has to be good value even without the warranty. Camera bodies seem to be the main problem area as Canon will not warranty a camera body purchased outside Australia, so I buy them here as they really aren't much more expensive if you shop around. Lenses, on the other hand, can be much cheaper and are less likely to break. Also, Canon (sorry I don't know the other brands) do warranty lenses bought overseas, so you don't even have to buy grey. I've only ever bought a few grey items, but that was some years ago when it was worth it (30% off!!!!). I do, however buy a lot of lenses form OS, usually from B&H, but all come with the manufacturers warranty. So I guess, I'm agreeing. Why bother to buy grey nowdays when it costs little extra to buy the warrantied item. But, if the grey item is sufficiently cheap then go for it and accept the loss of warranty.

I don't understand, if you buy from B&H you are buying grey either way. I know B&H have a grey import option but I thought that only affects US residents.

Steve Axford
28-09-2009, 1:14pm
I don't understand, if you buy from B&H you are buying grey either way. I know B&H have a grey import option but I thought that only affects US residents.
You buy lenses from B&H and you have a choice, "international" or "USA". If you buy USA, you get an international warranty from Canon. If you buy "International", you get a B&H warranty that you have to send back to them to get fixed. So, you don't have to buy grey from OS.

Paper_Mache_Man
28-09-2009, 2:24pm
Really?! I thought all Canon lenses were covered by an international warranty regardless of where it was purchased/imported from. If that's not the case...good to know. I guess that's another down side to grey/imports...you really need to check the fine print. :)

David
28-09-2009, 3:09pm
No way> A guy at my camera store told me today IF you can get an international warrranty serviced in Australia they go to the back of the queue behind the Australian Warranty/Brought jobs so you can be waiting months and months to get the camera back. For the extra dollars you pay to NOT buy grey imports and shop around and make a deal with the locals I would resist buying a body or lens from a 'grey' supplier.

Steve Axford
28-09-2009, 5:03pm
It is my understanding that (with Canon) camera bodies bought overseas have no Australian warranty even if they are not grey items where purchased. Lenses, on the other hand, have a full Australian warranty if they are purchased overseas and are not grey items. I think "a guy at my camera store" is not the best reference for this. Try calling Canon. They don't run a double queue.

To PMP. The B&H "International" means grey. The B&H "USA" means it is from Canon.

David
28-09-2009, 6:19pm
It is my understanding that (with Canon) camera bodies bought overseas have no Australian warranty even if they are not grey items where purchased. Lenses, on the other hand, have a full Australian warranty if they are purchased overseas and are not grey items. I think "a guy at my camera store" is not the best reference for this. Try calling Canon. They don't run a double queue.

To PMP. The B&H "International" means grey. The B&H "USA" means it is from Canon.


0k Steve, thanks for the advise

The Moose
28-09-2009, 7:03pm
I'd think about it but if I'm going to buy new, I don't think I would. If it's not used then it'll be bought from an authorised dealer.

TUN35
28-09-2009, 8:38pm
I did buy grey due to the saving and would again as long as I was making a reasonable saving.

luvmadaysoff
01-10-2009, 10:11pm
L series lenses I believe still have an international warranty. As for the Bodies, one has to ask ones self two questions:

1) how likely is it that a camera body of this magnitude (canon 30D, 40D, 5D MarkII), is going to become faulty from a warranty perspective?

2) If in the very small chance there is a problem, then this second question becomes simple; Is the cost of repair, like to be less than/equal to/greater than the amount saved by purchasing the real thing, simply imported from a grey import dealer (Non Authorised).

Some time ago I purchased a camera body from a grey importer. I then saw prices change over the next few weeks (currency/exchange rates), and mentioned that I wished I had of purchased the dearer model. His response: Bring it back in, we'll use it as a demo model, and we'll sell you the one you wanted". GOOD LUCK getting that response at "Teds" or another store.

We have since purchased thousands of dollars worth of stock from them, over several years, and are very impressed. My only gripe is that they are temporarily shut down while moving location. (* five weeks to go -Yippee!!)

A note of interest. They sell an incredible amount of stock, (November 2007 = approximately 35 DSLR camera bodies per week plus lenses & accessories). They mentioned to me that they had had a couple of cameras returned over the years with warranty problems. One customer waited while the unit was shipped back to manufacturer, repaired, returned, and picked up by customer within less than three weeks, (Canon Australia would be lucky to have looked at it by that time), while the other two customers, happily exchanged their camera body for a BRAND NEW body at No extra charge. Again, good luck getting that from some retail camera store. They don't want to know you half the time if your not there to potentially spend money!

On the other hand, if you have an out of the ordinary, very good camera retailer, then advice & service from them is very valuable, and sometimes well worth the spend.

kiwi
01-10-2009, 10:38pm
Shame if your camera died while they were moving. 5 weeks is a long time between shots.

Teds however are always there. And have always looked after me, despite the fact that I price shop vs Grey and sometimes they cant match price.

Im glad you like your current supplier, but you are making huge generalisations about Teds and Canon.

arubaato
01-10-2009, 11:51pm
I bought my 5D2 body plus a 135 f2L plus an extreme 4 16GB card in HK for less than a "authorised" body here. It's absolutely fine. So I would definitely buy "grey". The whole "grey import" name is just given by the authorised dealers as a scare tactic to encourage people to buy from them.

Redgum
02-10-2009, 12:09am
I don't think so but read the rest of this thread first.

bigdazzler
02-10-2009, 6:32am
Well .. I started this thread so ill give you my current situation. The body im looking at has just been released in OZ and is retailing at $3499 .. I can buy it from a grey importer (which i have used several times before for less expensive items without a problem in the world .. admittedly though, nothing has broken thus far for me to test their servicing/warranty conditions) for $2250 delivered. Thats a saving of $1250 or over 30% in my pocket .. I can almost buy a CZ prime to go on it with that. So yea, its worth the warranty risk for mine.

Steve Axford
02-10-2009, 10:25am
Is $3499 the best price available in Oz?

bigdazzler
02-10-2009, 11:04am
Is $3499 the best price available in Oz?

i think i saw one for $3200 but thats the best ive seen ..

Steve Axford
03-10-2009, 8:38am
That's a little surprising noways. Usually if you really look hard you can get the price down quite a lot, but if it was that much saving, then go for it. A saving of 25% is well worth having and more than compensate for any loss of warranty.

bigdazzler
03-10-2009, 8:49am
Yea Steve .. I guess the cameras only been out for a week or two now in OZ so advertised prices are still pretty close to RRP. Im sure if I walk into my local store with a wad full of hundreds I will get a much better cash price, but I doubt they could match an over 30% discount. And then you have to ask yourself, can you be bothered trolling the camera stores around Sydney looking for discounts when I can click away on my mouse and have it in my hands in 3 days at the lowest possible price ..

Im dying to buy it .. but my head is telling me to wait and get some hand on feedback and review before jumping in .. plus my missus might murder me if I do :eek::D

Steve Axford
03-10-2009, 10:50am
I see your point Daz. Delivery can be a problem in the early days too. I tend to wait a little now to let the prices stabilize.

bigdazzler
03-10-2009, 11:10am
My predicament is that with these paid wedding gigs coming up, i need to get my hands on a second body and quick. I was dead set on buying an A700 and had all but decided to stick with crop for a while, but then Sony went and confused me by releasing this A850 FF at a very tempting price point ..

I figure if im going to buy a second body for insurance and back up purposes i may as well make it a good upgrade .. cause i wont be buying another one for a long while after this, god knows ive spent enough money this year

arthurking83
03-10-2009, 11:21am
....

I figure if im going to buy a second body for insurance and back up purposes i may as well make it a good upgrade .. cause i wont be buying another one for a long while after this, god knows ive spent enough money this year

You're name is Yogi by chance?? :D
(smarter than the average bear.... :rolleyes:)

good plan, and stick with it.

.. and besides, ther's no problem if you're missues goes all Charles Manson on 'ya, if she murders you give her my contact details :th3:

NO!... no silly, not for her purpose... For your now redundant gear... well, you aren't going to be needing it... and it's got to go to a good home don't it? ;)

Stick with it, wait it out as long as possible, Aussie dollar is rising, and me thinks will continue against the US peso for a while yet and be back into the 90's sooner rather than later.

bigdazzler
03-10-2009, 12:09pm
youre right AK .. i got till mid November before i absolutely NEED the second body .. so a few weeks up my sleeve yet

mongo
03-10-2009, 6:31pm
Purchased new gear from Adorama that way and would again.

Aussieroo
06-10-2009, 7:31pm
Parallel importers can import anything intot he country since the government deregulated the import restrictions. If you wanted to se up your own Honda dealership in Australia and found a supplier in Japan prepared to sell you stock cheaper than you can get through Honda Australia and you can sell them cheaper retail and still make good money then you are allowed to. Doesn't make that product any better or worse. Just arrived via a different importer.

GREY market is a different thing. These people buy goods that may or may not have a problem. If on a production line an item is discovered faulty, they may isolate 10 before and 10 after that product and "Grey market them" rather than test all of them and repair them. These are usually sold without normal warranty and can be a great bargain or a pain in the rear end.

As far as warranty goes, my 100-400mm needed some repair and was only a couple of months outside of warranty and even though it is a high end item, Canon would have nothing to do with offering warranty assistance. I paid for the lot, ( well my insurance did in the end) Most parallel importers will replace a DOA item to keep their reputations in tact, The internet these days can make or break a business very quickly, so it doesn't pay them to P... off to many people.

Bails55
10-10-2009, 9:39pm
Portagadgets has it for $2194 and it looks like you can buy an extended international warranty as well. Dunno how useful that actually is though...

http://www.portagadgets.com/australia/product.php?productid=36394

HelenOster
14-10-2009, 7:05am
Parallel importers can import anything intot he country since the government deregulated the import restrictions. If you wanted to se up your own Honda dealership in Australia and found a supplier in Japan prepared to sell you stock cheaper than you can get through Honda Australia and you can sell them cheaper retail and still make good money then you are allowed to. Doesn't make that product any better or worse. Just arrived via a different importer.

GREY market is a different thing. These people buy goods that may or may not have a problem. If on a production line an item is discovered faulty, they may isolate 10 before and 10 after that product and "Grey market them" rather than test all of them and repair them. These are usually sold without normal warranty and can be a great bargain or a pain in the rear end.



I just came across this thread, and wanted to clarify some of the points that you made - at least as far as Adorama is concerned.

"Grey market" refers to products imported directly into the US, rather than through the manufacturer's authorized agents / distributors. It is perfectly legal to directly import & sell these products in the US; the term "grey market" was coined by manufacturer's authorized distributors who wanted to discourage consumers from buying these (less costly) goods.

With no factory authorized middle-man involved in the import of these products, costs are lower, so the price is lower to our customers. Many items which are in short supply or not imported at all by the manufacturer's authorized distributors are available in direct import.

Any of our products which are being sold as such will be clearly marked, and you are more than welcome to contact me directly should you have any concerns regarding a specific listing.

There is no difference in the actual products. Occasionally manufacturers will name them differently for example the Olympus USA Digital Stylus Cameras are called Olympus MJU Cameras in Europe
On direct import products purchased from Adorama, we offer the same warranty as the USA warranted products carry for a period of one year. The only difference is that you would need to ship it to Adorama for warranty service.

BTW, I have no personal experience of the following, however I've been advised by customers who have tried, that Canon will service under warranty any item purchased from an authorized Canon reseller, whether direct import or not. They will service any Canon item with a fee if it is otherwise not under warranty, but Nikon USA will not service a direct import item at all, whether the customer is willing to pay or not.

I hope this helps.

If you have any further queries regarding any aspect of Adorama Camera, or AdoramaPix, please do not hesitate to contact me directly:


Sincerely

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador

helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
www.adorama.com

I @ M
14-10-2009, 7:16am
Thanks for the very concise reply regarding Adorama's stock Helen, with the exchange rate of the AUD to the USD looking healthier all the time all the overseas retailers are back on many peoples shopping lists. :)

Now all you have to do is talk the freight companies on your side of the world into giving discounts to Aussies. :D

HelenOster
14-10-2009, 7:20am
Thanks for the very concise reply regarding Adorama's stock Helen, with the exchange rate of the AUD to the USD looking healthier all the time all the overseas retailers are back on many peoples shopping lists. :)

Now all you have to do is talk the freight companies on your side of the world into giving discounts to Aussies. :D

Some items, depending upon value / fragility / weight, can be sent US mail - which can be less expensive. It is always worth contacting me before placing an order to check it out.

Aussieroo
14-10-2009, 7:22am
I think we are in agreement here just the terminology varies between countries. I prefer the term parallel importer actually as "Grey" has a "dark side" connotation. I have been happy to buy this way for years both camera gear and computers.

bigdazzler
14-10-2009, 8:17am
Some items, depending upon value / fragility / weight, can be sent US mail - which can be less expensive. It is always worth contacting me before placing an order to check it out.

OK then ... :D

Hi Helen, i just posted a separate thread about your services but i may as well enquire here.
Im interested in buying a Sony A850 body. Do you have them in stock ready to go ?? What is the best price you can do for me including shipping for the body ?? If youd prefer to keep that bit private, please PM me with the info. Thanks :)

Aussieroo
14-10-2009, 4:57pm
Just to quash the "To the back of the queue" theory in regards to Canon.

I had the misfortune of dropping my 100-400mm lens and sent it in for repairs.
Within 8 days I had a phone call from them and a letter acknowledging the receipt of the lens.
When I agreed to proceed with the repairs at my expense as it was 2 months out of warranty and I DID drop it it was only another week till I received another call to pay for the repairs and a further 24 hours before the lens landed back here. This on a lens that is a parallel imported lens and not a hint of any discrimination because of that. I have tested the lens and compared t to another 100-400mm lens and have to say I am more than happy with the repair. I am pleased I had it insured as it would have cost me about $590 otherwise. So while it is easy to criticise the "Big boys" sometimes in my case I am very happy with their service.

Pedro
17-10-2009, 7:40pm
Voted Yes. I would have to be saving heaps to go for a body but I've bought a number of L lenses on the grey market and had good experiences. Even did an exchange on a bad copy of a lens that actually wasn't really bad. I ended up having the lens/camera re-calibrated by Canon (luckily camera was bought from an official supplier and the L lenses are all covered by a worldwide Canon warranty).
These days with a camera that has inbuilt calibration abilities and if the savings were substantial I'd buy grey. It's not to be feared if you buy from a decent supplier and can have warranty services performed locally. Wouldn't like the hassle of sending it OS.
As an aside, My future target body, the 7D, is presently more expensive through Discount Digital grey than through other suppliers with Canon Aust warranty!!

MATT
18-10-2009, 9:14am
I will vote yes.. I have bought grey before, and had no trouble..

With my D700 it had a focus problem and the focus confirm beeper failed. So I sent it off to the Nikon Authorised repair agent in Brisbane.

3 months later :( it returned and was not working.. A quick phone call and return, another 2 weeks it was back in my hands. Nearly 4 months is a long time to wait.. They said they were waiting on parts.. Oh and could not find a problem with the focus..

Back in my hands for 1 1/2 months it is now sent off to Nikon in Sydney for repair still not happy with the focus , my D70 out focuses it.. However I wonder how long it will take this time.:confused013. may have been quicker to send back to HK.


I am not happy with the camera but communication has been good. Would I get that from a Import supplier?? may be depends on who I guess.

The camera was bought from my local camera shop as they have an affiliation with Teds and gave me a very competitive price at the time. Recently I went to PC in Brisbane and was discussing my D700 with them, the sales man said if I would have bought it from them, he would have swapped it over for a new one straight away...Could have been jsut talk..

MATT

Q97
18-10-2009, 10:48am
After my D60 dying - no, I wouldn't.

Even though it is outside of the 12 month Nikon warranty period, if I hadn't of had the extended warranty, I would have fought Nikon to rectify it through statutory warranty rights and provisions. Fair chance I would have been successful in doing so. But if it was a grey/parallel import, Nikon could offer the defence that they never offered the item for sale and that would be that.

Nikolas
18-10-2009, 11:21am
To those who bought large ticket items (ie items over $1500 and upwards) what did it cost you in import duties/gst/customs?
Any examples?

ricktas
18-10-2009, 11:27am
After my D60 dying - no, I wouldn't.

Even though it is outside of the 12 month Nikon warranty period, if I hadn't of had the extended warranty, I would have fought Nikon to rectify it through statutory warranty rights and provisions. Fair chance I would have been successful in doing so. But if it was a grey/parallel import, Nikon could offer the defence that they never offered the item for sale and that would be that.

Depends on the reason it died. Warranty only covers manufacturing fault/defect. Nikon, Canon etc are not the big nasty monster. They are reasonable and will talk to you regarding repairs, even if a grey market item.

ricktas
18-10-2009, 11:28am
To those who bought large ticket items (ie items over $1500 and upwards) what did it cost you in import duties/gst/customs?
Any examples?

Grey market doesnt mean you import it yourself. There are quite a few stores in Aus that import them and sell them, so you buy from a store in Aus, but not stock supplied by the Australian arm of the manufacturer. Therefore most would not have any idea what the duties etc were, just the GST component

Nikolas
18-10-2009, 11:33am
Thanks Rick
I was meaning buying from Adorama etc or direct from honkers as some people have said they have done.

Viper
18-10-2009, 2:09pm
Bought my D80 and D300 that way.

Darvidanoar
18-10-2009, 3:58pm
OK, so it looks like most of us are willing to purchase parallel import gear and a few people have mentioned that their experience has been good.

Can we also hear from a few people who have had their parallel import gear fail under warranty?
What was the warranty handled well? Was it a good, bad or otherwise expereince?

HelenOster
18-10-2009, 4:57pm
What is an "International" warranty? I know with some companies that means RTB (Return to Base) for repair which can be prohibitive cost wise and a challenge with customs. If you're unfortunate enough to need this, is it worth it?

We only work with Mack - not that I'm saying they are any better (or worse) than anybody else!
I'd personally always recommend the purchase of a Mack or other International warranty alongside any purchase from overseas - grey / direct import or not. If, for example, you purchase from a US retailer, the warranty you receive is in any case a US warranty and therefore only valid in the US.
We have heard of many instances where outside the US even some of the big names have refused to support warranty service on gear purchased from US websites. That means you have to return it to the US (or other country of purchase).

So, in my opinion, you may as well purchase direct import and use the money you save to get the warranty on top.

BTW, I'd always check out the option of purchasing a refurbished item, too - just make sure that the item has been refurbished by the manufacturer, and that it comes with a minimum 3-month warranty.

Q97
18-10-2009, 5:16pm
Warranty only covers manufacturing fault/defect.

True, sort of. The key point I'd like to make is that by statute, that is not necessarily limited to 12 months.

cupic
19-10-2009, 11:52pm
thats interesting Kym. Maybe I was just unlucky.

Way back when when i bought my 10-20 I called tham and asked them if they would match the price from DigtialRev because Id prefer to buy local if possible but without being out of pocket .. no-one returned my call.

I ended up buying the lens at Canera House because I got a very good deal in the end ...



I email Kennedy's and got a reply from Clem kennedy....anyways, eventually he emailed back and now its looks like Im saving 1K on a sigma 100-300 f/4,and I, just waiting on a reply


cheers

cupic
19-10-2009, 11:56pm
We only work with Mack - not that I'm saying they are any better (or worse) than anybody else!
I'd personally always recommend the purchase of a Mack or other International warranty alongside any purchase from overseas - grey / direct import or not. If, for example, you purchase from a US retailer, the warranty you receive is in any case a US warranty and therefore only valid in the US.
We have heard of many instances where outside the US even some of the big names have refused to support warranty service on gear purchased from US websites. That means you have to return it to the US (or other country of purchase).

So, in my opinion, you may as well purchase direct import and use the money you save to get the warranty on top.

BTW, I'd always check out the option of purchasing a refurbished item, too - just make sure that the item has been refurbished by the manufacturer, and that it comes with a minimum 3-month warranty.


I bought a Pentax lense from a rival and email Pentax HQ and was issued a worldwide warranty on the product purchased from the US


cheers

flamezy
31-10-2009, 7:07pm
I've bought a few grey stuff over the past few years with no problems. Recently got a 7D grey as well.

TassieSnapper
31-10-2009, 7:15pm
Absolutley. The savings are insane.

The other option is to import from OS, I have bought several items from B and H photo in the US when the aussie dollar has been good and saved a packet. Delivery from their NY store was faster than recieving goods from some australian retailers.

Most of the items sold in local stores here are insanely overpriced.

triblea
01-11-2009, 4:46am
Yes. I bought every thing via internet from gray importer or oversea, save a lot.

Redgum
01-11-2009, 10:34am
Yes. I bought every thing via internet from gray importer or oversea, save a lot.
Just remember that every time you purchase overseas direct you put an Aussie mate out of work. And that's just not camera gear. At least grey importers employ people here and pay taxes. Never know who's job it will be next. :action53:

Natsky
01-11-2009, 3:11pm
Ok so I am going to be the fly in the ointment.

I had an awful grey lens experience where I ended up losing money and vowed never to do it again. As long as nothing goes wrong in that first year, all good, but you just don't know.

I am interested to know what monetary value members place on building a relationship with their local seller? I have spent a lot of money in the last 12 months on gear and could possibly have saved hundreds if I had purchased online. But what value do I place on 'free' advice, try before you buy, free studio time, being able to use a pro lens while still paying it off etc etc etc. These have all been of huge benefit and as one of their premium customers, I enjoy A class service. I find it much easier to take in my gear and ask a question than trying to explain via telephone or email. Because I support them, they support me and as somebody trying to make their way as a pro I find that invaluable.

My worry is that if everybody keeps buying grey and online, we won't have these experienced, passionate people we can talk to face to face, as the local retailer battles to be competitive.

bobt
01-11-2009, 3:30pm
Voted no - you need maybe and candy options.

yeah ... I voted "yes" but there are a few variable - mainly how much saving is involved!!

mattsuzu
04-11-2009, 11:42pm
I think the bottom line is we as Aussies, pay more than most for almost everything... Im all for it, companies need to see that they can't just charge whatever they want, and people WILL go elsewhere if pushed...

whatsthatbeeping
04-11-2009, 11:50pm
I buy grey pretty much all the time now. D-D Photographics Brisbane (hi Chris!!). Bricks and mortar store that I can talk to the staff about things, savings are generally 20% on chain store prices, helpful and convenient as well.
Had no problems with the "grey equipment" (touch wood) and have bought 3 bodies, flashes, bags, cf cards etc through, them plus all my non 2nd hand lenses.
I would however have an issue with buying "grey" over the Internet, just doesn't feel right as a consumer, call me old fashion, I like the face to face transactions and building a relationship with my supplier.

Tim

Redgum
07-11-2009, 12:42am
I think the bottom line is we as Aussies, pay more than most for almost everything... Im all for it, companies need to see that they can't just charge whatever they want, and people WILL go elsewhere if pushed...
Choice has always been out there, finding it is sometimes the trouble.

cinvala
10-11-2009, 9:02am
I will, if the price is right, and it seems the higher the price item, the more you save. I like to do a bit of research first, i.e. sites like this and see which sellers are complimented which ones aren't. Whilst warranty is important to a certain degree, if I was to buy say a Canon 5d mark II body, Aust import with warranty is around $4000, grey import around $3000, thats a $1000 toward a decent lens and worth the risk.

colcha
19-11-2009, 6:39pm
I will, if the price is right, and it seems the higher the price item, the more you save. I like to do a bit of research first, i.e. sites like this and see which sellers are complimented which ones aren't. Whilst warranty is important to a certain degree, if I was to buy say a Canon 5d mark II body, Aust import with warranty is around $4000, grey import around $3000, thats a $1000 toward a decent lens and worth the risk.

With the recent Canon Australia price drops, the difference is only about $400 (less if you are unlucky enough to get hit with GST by Customs).

petercee
25-11-2009, 12:06am
Which best describes you?

a) I lie awake each night convinced that when I next use it, my "grey import" camera will blow a gasket. Why? Well because "grey imports", sometimes $1000 less than RRP, are obviously inferior builds. I may not know my Rs from my elbow, but I do know that imported products should be sent back along with the asylum seekers who bring them in.

b) I saved lots of money buying a direct import, knowing full well it is a mass-manufactured item subject to consumer protection practices, the same as any other store-bought item. If an item I buy breaks down, I do not instantly conclude that I've made a mistake, nor do I believe that my good fortune has turned bad. I sleep soundly.

c) I have as many problems trusting the guy at the local camera store as I have using a credit card. I'm convinced that buying a DSLR made by anyone other than Fred Hollows would be chalking up yet another victory to Satan. I'm gripping my big pillow, paralysed by fear.

PS: I research my purchases and buy from a credible supplier regardless of whether stock has arrived by plane, boat or truck.

reaction
26-11-2009, 1:10pm
My worry is that if everybody keeps buying grey and online, we won't have these experienced, passionate people we can talk to face to face, as the local retailer battles to be competitive.

Too late?
I've never met these experienced, passionate people, most shops employ award wage dummies.

msenior
26-11-2009, 1:59pm
I am tempted atm to buy the lens im after from
http://stores.ebay.com/Cameta-Camera

What is everyones experience with the gst and import duty you have to pay. I sort of understand how it works but then sort of don't.

cheers
Mike

peterb666
27-11-2009, 12:02am
Olympus comes with a worldwide warranty, so yes.

pbrunottephoto
14-01-2010, 7:05pm
If you buy from a local store, you build a partnership with that store.
Buying from os is way cheaper, and i take the risk.
Biz is biz.............

pbrunottephoto
14-01-2010, 7:08pm
I am tempted atm to buy the lens im after from
http://stores.ebay.com/Cameta-Camera

What is everyones experience with the gst and import duty you have to pay. I sort of understand how it works but then sort of don't.

cheers
Mike

If your lucky you dont pay gst / import... a lot of people are lucky.. But some items even with that cost , are still cheaper than buying local..

Aussieroo
14-01-2010, 7:43pm
This will be an ongoing debate for sometime as the world shrinks into one market and import rules are more relaxed.
The $800 I saved on my 100-400mm Canon IS lens was much better in my pocket than the local Canon dealer. It hasn't missed a beat in 18 months and is out of warranty now anyway. So I guess it is up to everyones confidence in buying online and who they deal with.

coolie21
14-01-2010, 7:48pm
For my recent big spend I compromised. Bought Aus stock body locally and bought lens at DDP.
The body was actually cheaper than the onshore bricks and mortar grey importers...

mikec
15-01-2010, 4:15pm
For my recent big spend I compromised. Bought Aus stock body locally and bought lens at DDP.


I'd probably do the same if it was a big enough saving. Although I do prefer to support the locals.

Aussieroo
15-01-2010, 5:00pm
I'd probably do the same if it was a big enough saving. Although I do prefer to support the locals.

Depends on your definition of "Locals" If you live in the country you have no option but to buy in the big city as there are few if any A grade Canon dealers outside the city that can supply you the upper end gear. Remember also a lot of the people you can buy from off the internet, are also locals who are enterprising enough to import directly themselves instead of going through Canon Australia or other "Official suppliers". We are becoming one world more and more and our dollars need to go further these days so any saving can be put towards other important things. Some city "Locals" flat out refuse to even haggle or come down in price, so support them if you can afford it, but I for one always search out the best deal. Be it a computer, LCD TV or camera gear.

AdamR
15-01-2010, 5:28pm
I totally agree with reaction, what passionate, knowledgable store persons are out there. Around my area are people who couldnt get a job at supre so went and asked next door. And I will do anything I can to not support shots who rip others off, selling cameras at good prices but memory cards at ridiculously expensive prices. Im talking 500% plus of other stores or online dealers.

I buy within Australia usually, Discount Digital are fantastic. And for those scared of warranty issues, Ive had them, took them to DD and it was resolved faster than Canon Aust. Hmmm. The only person who I would buy Australian stock is Quality Cameras, they are really good.

Helen S
15-01-2010, 5:40pm
I actually voted no (and my next body will be Australian stock), but I happily bought my 40D grey market and will probably do the same for hubby's 7D (when I recover from the 5D MkII).

All my lenses have been bought grey market and with each and every one, like our cameras, I've purchased an extended warranty also (for peace of mind)... and always from companies in Australia. Like Redgum, I like to see the Aussie dollar turned over in Australia to keep as many of us employed as possible. :)

Slide
15-01-2010, 5:56pm
I voted no, but I probably would from local grey importers (DDP), where I know I can go see/call them if there is a problem and it's not going to be email communication with everything.

Harrier
15-01-2010, 6:10pm
I did and a sh lens on Ebay, brilliant! If you live in the bush, only way to go!

Steadyhands
15-01-2010, 6:14pm
I voted yes. I've bought bodies from local stores, but at the time they were so close to matching the price of place like DD's and CamerasDirect it made no difference. With lenses it's been another story altogether. Most have been bought at either DD or CamerasDirect and the savings have been put to good use elsewhere.

The grey market guys are business people just like the local stores. Saying we aren't supporting the economy by buying from a grey market importer doesn't cut it in my book.

Speedway
15-01-2010, 6:50pm
I voted yes too and have just been doing some research on a 7D and 150-500 sigma and just started another thread asking a few questions
Keith.

fungry
16-01-2010, 1:07am
I would if the price difference warrants it.

Pinheadion
17-01-2010, 11:57pm
I did it with my old K10D and also purchased lenses from OS and nothing ever gave me issues. As others have said the quality is exactly the same, its when you DO have problems that it becomes a lot more troublesome, and I only say that because of what i've been lead to believe by normal Aus dealers, not from experience. I plan on purchasing a 7D from an Australian 'grey import' dealer soon. If anyone has any recommendations let me know :)

griffljg
18-01-2010, 5:53am
I think that you left out an option "It depends...." ;-)

For me..... It depends on whether the price difference is great enough to forget about any warranty support. For a camera body, the difference would have to be fairly large. For a lens, less so.

wideangle
30-01-2010, 12:18pm
Which best describes you?

a) I lie awake each night convinced that when I next use it, my "grey import" camera will blow a gasket. Why? Well because "grey imports", sometimes $1000 less than RRP, are obviously inferior builds.


Do you believe this, or do you mean some people would be thinking this? I wouldn't think that that items that grey market are "inferior builds" as at the end of the day all cameras that come into Australia and are sold at brick and morter shops are bought in from Asia. If you buy grey import you are importing directly yourself, rather than the shops doing it and adding on duties/customs etc.

benton007
31-01-2010, 4:57pm
i bought my d700 foff ebay from an aus dealer who ships out of HK, was nervous but had no probs, saved over $1500 so even if warrenty way a prob its only for the first year and $1500 goes a long way for repairs.

I @ M
31-01-2010, 5:11pm
i bought my d700 foff ebay from an aus dealer who ships out of HK, was nervous but had no probs, saved over $1500 so even if warrenty way a prob its only for the first year and $1500 goes a long way for repairs.

Now if only we could get the public numbers going to make Nikon take notice, reduce their prices and make their 2 year warranty (http://www.nikon.com.au/pagearticle.php?pageid=220-17b78f9507) permanent. :angry0:

JimD
08-04-2010, 11:41am
Body no, lens yes.

Mr Scrofulous
09-04-2010, 1:19pm
It's not abotu inferior build of grey-market bodies.
We had a brand new IDs Mk II blow it shutter at less than a week old. Without warranty support, that would have been an expensive event. We got a replacemtn camera, and teh faulty one went back to CAnon factory for analysis, as it was unprecedented.
So, while we have had no problem with our grey market lenses, we've had enough body failures to make us unwilling to go there with bodies.

pgbphotographytas
09-04-2010, 2:55pm
I would not for a body but for a lens I might.

Paul

Ploddy
13-04-2010, 9:52pm
Well, bough my 7D from d-d and all i can say is... wow.

Between $600-$800 under RRP, easily $400 under best 'Aussie' price.

Ordered and paid 4pm Monday, delivered 11am Tuesday.

Everything works exceptionally well.

So I voted ... yes.

bobt
13-04-2010, 10:32pm
At the end of the day, its a lot of money to risk, but its also a lot of money to save too ..

So .... are you feelin' lucky?

I've done it twice now and saved myself hundreds of dollars. it's all about how much risk you're comfortable with, how much gain is involved, and how much research you do. Think of it like marriage .......;)

mikec
14-04-2010, 12:41pm
I didn't think I would but when you save $500+ on the body, it makes the decision a lot easier!

I was just annoyed that the supplied local adapter for the charger was faulty, but a quick trip to Dicksmith saw me with a new cord and all is well.

rufus
14-04-2010, 4:01pm
Yes, I bought my 500D and 18-55 from Digital Rev, for $920, with extra battery, and 8gb SD Card, the cheapest here was around the $1250 at the time. 5 months and no problems.

Robbo
14-04-2010, 8:24pm
No way,

But what i am doing now is using a print off off the gray market web site and taking it down to a retailer that will beat any price. some times they cant match it but while your there they might as well give you a price.

Craggles
14-04-2010, 11:24pm
I got a brand new 50D with 50mm f/1.8 for $1100, its not like I have no warranty at all with that, I've dealt with warranty through DWI before and it was fine...

Asurfa
15-04-2010, 11:18am
I would love a new 5d2. The gray imports prices for this camera make it only just within my grasp... so yes because i don't have the funds for anything else.

nick351
15-04-2010, 11:24am
Just bought the nikon 24-70 from DWI on Monday, it was delivered Wednesday. Can't complain about the service, I paid $1940 delivered including credit card surcharges and delivery. Saved a couple hundred by dealing with them and woul be happy to buy from them again.

jprobertson
17-04-2010, 10:28am
i've bought a few bits and piece grey market. i got my 400D through an ebay importer and my 70-200mm, 580exII and 50D through DD photographics. Haven't had a problem, the service was quick and clean. i buy australian stock where and when i can though...gotta help out the aussie retailers. plus on lesser items, theres less of a hassle sorting out repairs/warranty job on aussie stock.

Erin
17-04-2010, 2:34pm
Did buy grey market quite happily. I wanted a D90 and a zoom lens. Going through the "authorised" dealers, it would have cost me $900 more than what I bought both for in the end. Not even a friend who had a shop franchise could give me a better deal on his mates rates. That's a significant saving. I've also bought all my subsequent lenses grey market and saved at least $60-$100 on each one.

0Z320
17-04-2010, 10:32pm
I voted yes.
I originally wanted to purchase from Harvey Norman, but ended up saving just over $1000.00 over the net.

This saving will buy me the following:
Camera Bag
Extra battery
CF card
Tripod
wireless trigger
Flashgun etc etc.....

simonr23
23-04-2010, 9:30pm
i wouldnt have a problem buying from the more recognised grey companies. my next lens will be from one actually.

macroshooter
24-04-2010, 1:19am
I would

Redgum
24-04-2010, 10:12am
I can understand that. The laws in the US are quite different with far less protection outside the trade rules.
What needs to be clear here is how we distinguish the "grey" market. In fact there are two markets, one of which are the "parallel importers", businesses that import to Oz legally but in competition with "approved" importers. The other importers are generally not represented on-shore and often avoid tax liabilities and warranty obligations. These are the true "grey" market.
Parallel importers are fine, a legitimate business competing legally with other importers but with much lower margins, considerably lower and subsequently their prices are more than attractive. They actually import goods identical to and from the same source as the approved importer.
Parallel importers can access "international" warranties as suppliers like Canon and Nikon will only honour warranty on regional (country) purchases. So goods imported by parallel importers don't enjoy local warranty. However, most parallel importers have an arrangement or coverage with authorised repair agencies in Oz which is paid for from the huge reduction in initial purchase price.
In essence the parallel importer covers any warranty costs from margins, makes a good return and saves you up to one third of the expected purchase price if bought through an "authorised" dealer. It's called competition, it's above board and of great benefit to the purchaser. And it is economically sound with the same employment opportunities for locals.

dragomir media
25-04-2010, 4:32pm
i just ordered a grey market D90, del'd to my door is half the price aus retail. what i'd like to know is how the retailers here can justify an at least 100% price hike when all you really get is the warranty, wich is worthless after 12 months anyway.

bobt
25-04-2010, 4:47pm
They have to factor in costs of shop rental, sales staff, Canon warranty, general customer service, differing wholesale costs and different profit margins and taxing arrangements.

When we go into a local shop and examine the cameras they get nothing from us at all. We then go and buy them on the 'net while the local guy is paying for his shop and staff at higher wages than O/s but getting zilch from us.

I did the same thing myself and it saved me $500 - but I can still see that it's not comparing apples with apples. I sometimes feel a little guilty shopping locally and knowing full well I plan on buying on the 'net. Doesn't actually stop me .... but it is food for thought. :cool:

Palomine
26-04-2010, 11:16am
A friend was in the market for a low end DSLR and asked my opinion about where to buy. Having explained the difference between brick and mortar stores and grey market stores she visited DWI. She never looked back.
I guess, given her experience, I would have no problem buying from DWI.

Beej
26-04-2010, 7:57pm
I considered going grey market for about a year.... in the end, I just figured the sleep I would lose over whether or not my new kit would fall apart as I took it out of the box made my mind up for me. The peace of mind was worth the extra grand to me. To others, not so much. It seems the savings are only really worthwhile when you get into the higher price ranges and then, do you want to put all that money on a gamble?

steamy
27-04-2010, 2:47am
Will be grey all the way for me!

Prob get it from DWI as well.
I will save enough money to get that extra lens and a few extras (filters, timers and other bits to suit the new gear)
Plus with the money I save I'll get a Mack Diamond International 3 year warranty that goes way beyond
just a basic manufacturers warranty which it covers but also covers for impact damage, sand & grit damage,
accidental & unintentional abuse, mechanical malfunctions and normal & abnormal wear & tear!
To me that is total peace of mind, it can be transferred ($20USD) if I sell which is a great selling feature.

If I need to get something done it goes to the local Nikon Authorised Service Centre here in Perth,
I don't have to send it over east, honkers or the states.

Grey gear comes off the same conveyer belt (Thailand for Nikon) as the gear you buy in the shop here in Oz.
So it's not going to be any diff, lesser quality, inferior etc etc.
Might come with a adaptor for the AC charger and possibly an odd manual but you download the English one
off the web anyway, the rest in the box is all the same.

ravescar
27-04-2010, 11:53am
grey market body and lens all the way for me, got my gears from d-d photographic at ok price.

If the price difference is substantial that is.

Some Aus pricing for gear is just bull.

tomtom1
27-04-2010, 10:41pm
I'd get a body from somewhere like d-d, probably give hk gift importers a miss though.

steamy
29-04-2010, 6:36pm
I ordered my D90 with 18-200VRII from DWI on Wednesday late arvo.
Was $50 more than citiwide and D-D.
* comments removed. Refer to site rule 13 - admin *

So peace of mind knowing if I need to call for any manufacturer warranty I know
I will get through when I need to.
Plus they were extremely helpful.
(I have nothing to do with them, just worth a mention I thought!)

debs
01-05-2010, 10:56am
I bought my 7d and lens from an Australian shop, wouldn't trust buying online for such a big purchase, I was happy with my shop price.

But will probably buy a flash from online with a saving of about $150.

Kallam McDougall
03-05-2010, 8:24pm
I have bought most of my accessories this way but the bodies I have used Harvey Normans Interest free and paid them off $30 a week. I can justify this to my darling better half.

rborsje
08-05-2010, 6:18pm
Body - Nope - it's all a matter of moving parts. The more complex the item, the more chance of something going wrong. Lens - Yes. I've brought off d-d last month and their delivery was very quick and prices excellent.

I @ M
08-05-2010, 6:19pm
Body - Nope - it's all a matter of moving parts. The more complex the item, the more chance of something going wrong. Lens - Yes. I've brought off d-d last month and their delivery was very quick and prices excellent.

Bet you there are more moving parts in your lenses than your camera bodies. :rolleyes:

Craigvtr
09-05-2010, 9:37am
I have bought direct from overseas and through Aus parrallel importers and have never yet had a problem.

aycee
09-05-2010, 10:43am
Having bought all my later cameras ..that included FF and L lenses through the grey market i voted yes but there is normally is an Oz warranty with them if you buy from one of those that offer it...and i have had one claim that was fixed immediately

depends on you love of money i suppose and you love of the gamble

Robert Horler
09-05-2010, 7:37pm
Been there, done that. Agree with post #16. BUT a friend just waiting for a $1700 Nikkor lens has just been pulled up by customs, bloody Hell !!

joele
12-05-2010, 10:06am
Depends on the price difference. I got my 50d locally (photopro) for $1,097, I could have got a grey one for around $950. for the price difference I thought it was worth having a local warranty. Plus being so close to $1,000 I risk paying GST and custom duties, esp if they put $950 as the value and put shipping value above that, as the $1,000 includes the shipping charge.

For a bigger price difference from a grey market importer I have seen has been around for a number of years I would take the risk.

DaveNQ
13-05-2010, 2:46pm
A few people in this thread have mentioned D-D. Are we talking Discount Digital Photographics (Sydney Brisbane) or D-D Electronics which looks like it is based in Singapore. Thanks.

MajorPanic
13-05-2010, 7:18pm
Yup! I bought my D70s & D300 grey market & had no problems at all.

My D700, I got a really good deal on from an AU Nikon supplier so all is kosher with that body. ;)

danny
13-05-2010, 7:38pm
I'm new to photography and now I want to go overseas (asia) 1. for the great photo opportunities and the 2. to get my hands on some cheaper gear. So it's a big yes for me.

kiwi
14-05-2010, 6:01am
A few people in this thread have mentioned D-D. Are we talking Discount Digital Photographics (Sydney Brisbane) or D-D Electronics which looks like it is based in Singapore. Thanks.

The former


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

kiwi
14-05-2010, 6:01am
I'm new to photography and now I want to go overseas (asia) 1. for the great photo opportunities and the 2. to get my hands on some cheaper gear. So it's a big yes for me.

You may actually find it no cheaper, in fact even more expensive


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

bort
17-05-2010, 8:28pm
Recently bought my 7D thru DWI - it all went great, would do it again

ricktas
17-05-2010, 8:29pm
Recently bought my 7D thru DWI - it all went great, would do it again

So seeing you have been a member for over 12 months, how about showing us how you use the 7D?

bort
17-05-2010, 10:02pm
So seeing you have been a member for over 12 months, how about showing us how you use the 7D?

Sure thing - still looking over the forum (its been a while)

cafezeenuts
25-05-2010, 10:41am
I never seen so much fuss about "grey import" until i got into photography and join photography forums....

For me, i always buy "grey import" because the saving is so great you be mad if you dont gamble on them. But I always do my research on the seller and product before i buy...

The only difference is buying locally is the place you send the product to for warranty service and a HUGE mark up. People you're forgetting something here, "The product is always the same and comes from the same manufacture"....

Either way you still have to wait for warranty service if its a lemon... Doesn't matter where you buy it from....

Schmenz
26-05-2010, 11:44pm
if you are lucky you can get aus stock at grey prices!


just go into a few camera shops and price match. some of the staff in shops arent too grey market savvy. :)

bricat
27-05-2010, 7:58am
I purchased canon 7d recently and got stopped through customs. Even paying duties etc I ended up with the 2 lenses 16gb card etc for free. Same price as ted's online price. Had it gone through without hitch I would have saved substantially more. Have no regrets at this stage and although I worry about aussie jobs etc that is the governments concern(whichever party) Don't forget it was Keating I think who wanted free trade. I voted a reounding yes. cheers Brian

LEIGHTON
28-05-2010, 10:41am
Has anybody heard about the online auction for high priced items like DLSR camera? The bidder who quotes the lowest price wins? I'm not really sure but there seem to be a lot popping up!

Yes, if it will save me minimum of $500 otherwise i'll stick to local shops!

Papou
30-05-2010, 11:34pm
Yes for me also, BUT!! if i caan swing a deal that comes somewhere close locally i will and have done so at times. eg; if i were to buy a new body and the saving was $300 grey market versus local ide have to do my sums as take the import/gst componant and then if there was an issue withthe goods and you had to add the postage and insurance to send it to the repairer eyc then the $300 saving may bot end up being sso much of a saving after all.
The benefit of being able to walk into you local supplier and say "ereyago mate, its broke" and leave him with it to post n package it away for repairs sometimes saves a lot of fret n hassles.
But then again take the difference in pricing ifone were to buy say a Canon 7D or 5D11 from the likes of "Hardley Normans " then why wouldnt one look at the grey market for the most times huge price differences.
I know as ive been squizzin prices for these two bodies with lenses..
And the same can be said for other local dealers.
Sooner the bigger stores start competing within reason maybe they would lose less sales:rolleyes:..

SerenityGate
01-06-2010, 9:47pm
I've bought three cameras: Nikon coolpix8700, then a D80, now a D300s all on the grey market and have had no problems at all.
Peace & Happiness to you all

flash
09-06-2010, 8:18pm
just watch the import and gst tarriffs on the imports it could add up to as much as a "reputable" camera, some attract it and others dont! not sure why!

Watchamacallit
09-06-2010, 8:18pm
My D700, I got a really good deal on from an AU Nikon supplier so all is kosher with that body. ;)

Daim, how'd you score that?

I think the age old deal with grey vs local is always the cost savings, chance of problems, etc all weighed up. I think it's been reiterated over and over, that past the 12 month mark we're all in the same boat (unless you can swindle extended manufacturer's warranty).

Other than that, buy grey/paralell and 3rd party warranty (something like Mack Diamond warranty, haven't done it myself but heard it starts date of purchase) - can be cheaper and have some form of warranty for a period of time. Well, unless you drop it or something.

Xebadir
15-06-2010, 9:51am
My only concern would be with how reputable the seller was. For instance. DDE and their Australian sub DDP have prooved very reliable in selling other items, so I would be confident in buying a body from either of them as I know the service is reliable. But I would be a little skeptical buying such an expensive item from say an unknown buyer in HK,...that to me is too greater risk. But I guess it comes down to the individual and what they consider as safe.

annainoz
15-06-2010, 10:05am
I've bought books online before, hubby laptops from ebay businesses, but I've never bought an expensive camera online so I was hesitant .. and have checked out quite a few online stores and varying in prices too. It's the warranty that worried me but since reading here, feeling a bit more at ease and I have now decided from the positive comments about DDP that I will end up going with them (unless my local stores can beat that price but seriously doubt it). I don't mind a grey import as long as it does what it's supposed to.

dche5390
15-06-2010, 2:01pm
I am impartial to grey/local warrantied stock. I rarely buy brand new anyway.

ronaldhw
24-08-2010, 1:09pm
I usually buy grey market price if the price difference is more than 10% cheaper.

Usually grey market has cheaper price for camera bodies, and lower /mid level lenses; but not for pro level lenses. I recently purchased Nikkor 24-70mm from JB-Hifi Camera (Melbourne city), at A$2080 (RRP is A$2249, but I asked for better deal) , cheapest you can get from grey market is $1900; I travel overseas quite often, so I will be getting the $190 GST back (TRS), which makes the lens total to A$1890, cheaper than grey market (+ australian warranty) :)

ving
25-08-2010, 10:47am
bought my d40 off some asian ebay shop just before i joined here... what was that? 2007? its going just fine :D

about to buy a grey d90 off either DDE or blue fly mobile. :)

thegumbootman
26-08-2010, 8:07pm
I ended up getting my D90 from Ted's. I think if I were buying a higher end DSLR I'd buy grey just because the savings would be pretty significant.

Captured frame
27-09-2010, 9:26pm
Have purchased 2 bodies from the grey market and had nil problems both supplied with Aus. warranties,the second one I got hit by customs and it cost me $300 but I was still way in front from Aus pricing would consider doing so again if the price was right,have always received fast delivery and good service. Would prefer to buy in Aus. but will always take into consideration the best price if the dealer is reputable.

Eberbachl
27-09-2010, 9:35pm
Have bought a few bodies and a bunch of lenses from grey market importers in the past, and have saved a bunch of dough.

No issues yet (touch wood).

The money I've saved has probably been enough to pay for the D90 I recently bought.

:)

Alpacamike
27-09-2010, 10:36pm
I have bought all my gear on the so called gray market with no problems so far, I have a new lens coming in from a Japan retailer this week for less than half price than Australian retailers could offer me.
I have a postal tracking number and try where I can to pay with PayPal, I too would like to support the local suppliers but when there is such a big price difference, one cannot help but to choose the grey imports
You Just Have to be careful!

calloyd
05-10-2010, 1:30pm
I voted no but it would really depend where I bought it from and the price. If I was saving lots I'd buy from an Aussie grey market dealer who offered an Aussie warranty, if there wasn't much difference in price I'd buy from a local distributor to get the manufacturer's warranty.

My 550D is with Canon at the moment (purchased in April) so I was relieved to have bought it local. The price difference at that time was only about $100-200 between grey and local markets.

Gas
05-10-2010, 6:26pm
Not sure about this one - being a newbie i haven't bought a great deal of equipment. My camera i bought locally at a sale and saved $$$.

The grey market will save me dollars, but i do like the idea of a bricks and mortar store, and the assume the aussie dollar will remain in australia - even though the equipment comes from overseas. I am reluctant to spend $1000+ online.

LEIGHTON
10-10-2010, 9:57am
If buying on grey market will save at least $500 (considering that the Aussie$ is getting stronger lately), I would definitely go for it.

I @ M
22-10-2010, 6:55pm
More thoughts -----

If you feel that the camera body that you are buying is going to need warranty back up within 12 months of you buying it ---- are you buying the right brand to start with?

littlegod
23-10-2010, 2:44pm
I just pulled the trigger on a 60D from DDE in Singapore yesterday. I paid less than $1,000 (just! $997) so I'll be avoiding GST. All up, it'll cost me $1,032 to have it delivered to my doorstep. If I tried the same with Australian stock I'd be paying at least $500 more...now I'd like to support local business but at such big price differences it's just not possible for someone like me who has to get every $ past the missus :action:

The $500 I saved I put into a Sigma 30/1.4 and a 16GB Extreme SD card off Camera Market. I got CR Kennedy to (almost) match the price that DWI had advertised for it (paid $450 instead of the $427 DWI wanted), which is still at least $100 cheaper than I could have gotten it from any Aussie camera store...paid with a CBA Gold Card which doubles the two-year Sigma factory warranty :D

Overall, I paid $1,582 for a 60D, the Siggy and a top-notch SD card...I think I did well. Ted's would go a cent below $1,699 for the 60D body alone...:confused013

Bilgola
25-10-2010, 5:17pm
I've thought long and hard about this. The strongest argument is the moral one, ie supporting local business, but the price difference can be very large and too much temptation for me to resist. The warrantee argument is really not a reason to buy local as long as you choose your supplier carefully.

In the last two years I have purchased two bodies and a lens from a local Sydney outlet. I chose them because they have an office/shop, (somewhere to go back to in the case of problems). A years warrantee came with the body (return to shop) and in the case of the most recent purchase, a 7d I purchased a further 3 years warrantee for $125. I have no idea where they import from but their prices are based on the US$ because I watched their website and bought at the best price which reflected the climb of the Aussie $. In that last case I saved $840 compared to the ticketed price in one of the major camera outlets.

To me its a no brainer :) Mike

Xebadir
26-10-2010, 4:13pm
Its just unsustainable to buy camera gear in Australia now. As a student I can't afford to spend an extra 800 dollars+ on buying lenses or bodies just to support overpriced Australian retailers. I nearly dropped my jaw when I was quoted some 3800 dollars for a D700....When I can get one and a 14-24 for the same price why wouldnt I shop from Grey market...hell for that money I could probably get a D3S! The only way that we will ever see change is to stop supporting the problem...and I cant see this happening. There is no reason we should have to pay such a massive markup, and to me its bad luck to the retailers if because of Labour costs and unwillingness to change that they get screwed, Australia has managed to price itself out of every form of production it can by greed, and its the consumers who pay the price unless they are willing to look elsewhere.

Bercy
26-10-2010, 5:47pm
I bought my Canon 40D on line but from an Australian distributor with australian warranty card. But my lenses have come from USA and Hong Kong - go figure. Were I feel and need to disucss and "feel" the real thing, I go to Photographic Wholesalers here in Adelaide. They have RRP and then they do discount anyway, without having to barter. This place has some really good gear nad they take the time to advise - and I am very happy to pay a bit more for that! You just don't get that with "grey".

AdamC
03-11-2010, 7:57pm
If the price difference was great enough I might be tempted, but in general no. A few months ago I bought a Canon 5D MkII - paid $3035 for an Australian market unit. Grey ones were to be had for maybe $200-250 less - not worth it IMHO.

crum
04-11-2010, 7:16pm
I bought my 7D with 15-85mm lens from an Australian ebay seller who sources all stock from Hong Kong. No dramas whatsoever. Paid $1400 less than the advertised shelf price locally

phild
15-11-2010, 9:18pm
I too bought a 7D body only, over $500 less than the cheapest Canon Aust outlet, got here in 3 days from order, much faster service than I have ever had from an Australian reseller.

The only downside, a substandard international adapter, I had a good quality one spare so it wasn't an issue.

IMO if Canon (or any other brand) Australia don't want their resellers to go the way of the dinosaurs they need to be more responsive to currency changes and a little less money hungry. It's a much smaller and more competitive world nowdays.

This is my 4th DSLR body since the 20D, all others were purchased in Australia at prices at only a slight premium over grey imports.

I'd have happily payed a price halfway between the two from a genuine Australian dealer this time as well but 40% difference is too much money to throw away.

smurfinaus
30-11-2010, 11:00am
Yes i would. I was about to buy a grey body from DWI before buying outright my 450d on ebay (2nd hand local seller).
Sure with grey bodys you lose the manufacturer warranty but for me it boils down to the price difference between retail local (manufacturer warranty + convenience) vs price buying grey (including postage & issues later down the road if you need to have repairs etc under grey warranty).

colinl
30-11-2010, 11:49am
I'm looking at a new body at the moment and will get a grey one if need be. I bought a 105VR from a grey supplier recently and was very happy with the outcome. I would be happy to pay a little extra for equipment from local suppliers, but in the case of the lens, the differance was just too much ($700). The other aspect was no one had the lens in stock and the wait times were just too long. I think Harvey Norman said two weeks. I ended up getting it delivered from Hong Kong to my door and it was only a matter of days.

vanngirl
05-12-2010, 4:11pm
I don't feel the need to support the middle man importer who tacks on his bit for receiving a shipload of cameras and onsells them to the retailers. I don't feel disloyal about cutting them out of the process.

I bought my D700 from a local seller who um, grey imports. !:) It was $1000 cheaper than normal retail, and I paid for an extended 3 year warranty (which you'd no doubt do purchasing "normally"?). Have bought a cheapie 50mm off ebay seller, but other 2 lenses I bought I went back to my "local" (but grey) sellers. Other Aussie online sellers are cheaper than my local guys, but I like having an actual shopfront to go to, the convenience of being able to place an order and drive over and fetch my item the next day is very handy. I feel i've got the best of both worlds.

ecopix
21-12-2010, 4:25pm
Just be aware some of these importers operate on a knife edge to minimise markup and undercut prices. They don't stock anything of value. They take your money and then order, but in total, they are using new order revenue to pay their old order accounts with the suppliers. If orders become lean, or the exchange rate drops markedly, they can be caught, and the suppliers have been known to close their accounts. Then you've paid your money to a supplier who isn't a supplier any more.
This happened to a lot of people 2 years ago when the Aussie dollar went ballistic. I won't mention the trader because they recovered and are up and running again, but people lost money. A well-established Aussie grey importer with a shopfront, or one of the big well-established Hong Kong traders that actually carry stock of what you want, should be safe.

Redgum
21-12-2010, 4:35pm
Just be aware some of these importers operate on a knife edge to minimise markup and undercut prices. They don't stock anything of value. They take your money and then order, but in total, they are using new order revenue to pay their old order accounts with the suppliers. If orders become lean, or the exchange rate drops markedly, they can be caught, and the suppliers have been known to close their accounts. Then you've paid your money to a supplier who isn't a supplier any more.
And of course you don't have to be a grey importer to use this business model. Some highly reputable camera stockists have used this practice for a long time and gone up and down as a consequence.

skunky
21-12-2010, 4:46pm
Absolutely, and I will continue to buy grey-market until the likes of Nikon, Canon and Sony stop gouging Australian customers nearly double that paid for gear in overseas markets. I understand that local distributors need to hedge against the US dollar or the Yen weakening against the Australian dollar, but this really cant account for the massive differences.

Eventually, the local retailers will start putting enough pressure on the distributors to reduce the stock costs in order to be competitive with the imports without too much of their own margin. Well, one can only hope that'll be the case or there really wont be much of a future for your local camera store.

colinl
21-12-2010, 6:24pm
I've bought a lens, body and speedlight from an Australian online place. All items were shipped from HK. I did give my local shops a go before doing this, and in the lens and bodies case none of them stocked the items I wanted. Their quoted long delivery times and high prices made the decision quite easy.

There has been some reports in the media about this lately, as various business groups have complained about a lack of sales because of online trading. It is always said that we do this to escape GST. I'd have to say that I never even thought of this when I bought my gear. It was just the fact I could get the gear so much quicker and much cheaper. A 10% premium wouldn't have made a difference in my decision.

I just bought a saltwater chlorinator for my pool online. It was from an Australian online supplier based in Newcastle. I did this because the unit I bought at my local shop 3 years ago failed for its second time. I went to my local shop, but they only supplied this same brand and another they didn't recommend. They offered no other options, even when I said I wasn't happy with the brand I had, and they sold.

Lizzie
21-12-2010, 6:42pm
Said Yes, warranty on Grey (Australian importer) stands up as well if not better than the big companies, in my experience, the service, information and treatment first class.

SerenityGate
08-01-2011, 12:04am
I've bought three Nikons from overseas and never had a problem. First a Coolpix 8700, then Nikon d80 which I still have and use occasionally, depending on what I have on the D300s I bought just over 12 months ago.
Imagine someone with more money than sense going into Hardly Normal and buying a D700 for $3990. Grey market models are under $2100 now. If Australian importers just sold from their factories, cameras would be much cheaper than paying for shop frontages, usually staffed with people who know very little about advanced cameras.

Duane Pipe
21-01-2011, 12:43pm
Well that depends on what damage Mr Bloody Hardly Norman has done,
Hopefully more harm to his own empire :th3: than to the consumer

Namus
26-01-2011, 8:39pm
I have bought a body off DWI before; no issues at all and fast postage to boot - do recommend :th3:

kexkez
30-01-2011, 10:26am
I am finally looking at buying my first dslr in the next few months, if not sooner. I'd be voting yes as well if the vote thing was still active for me. Just tossing up between a canon 500d and the 550 body.

Arg
03-02-2011, 12:54am
Yes for me. Saved $3,000 on retail, that covers a lot of warranty work. None needed so far, 5 months in. And my OS supplier has an Australian address for warranty repairs.

snat56
03-02-2011, 6:43pm
Bought my D90 and 18-200 that way from co. in Sydney. Had a problem with thet lens - autofocus fail. returned for warranty repairs no problem. Did I mention the savings? Anyway - would do so again as long as the dealer was reputable and had am establish australian service agent....

Reflector
13-02-2011, 7:49pm
I'm currently considering a 550D body with 18-55mm kit lens and found the following options:
$724 grey KISS X4 from Hong Kong free postage
or
$895 local imported grey KISS X4 free postage
or
$1295 local stock EOS 550D

Defenitely leaning towards the grey from HK considering the price difference which could be put towards another lens :th3:

Only thing holding me back from making the purchase is the release of EOS 600D / KISS X5

So another vote for grey imports from me provided i feel comfortable with the source in terms of reliability

C.J.

kexkez
14-02-2011, 9:37pm
Reflector judging by the price that would be who I was planning to get my kit from. I ended up just getting the body from them at $660 though as last week they had upped the price of the kits to 740. :) Hopefully it should arrive this week. BTW There is an additional $15 insurance to add to that cost. You don't hear about it until you say you'll buy.

Reflector
16-02-2011, 12:30am
Reflector judging by the price that would be who I was planning to get my kit from. I ended up just getting the body from them at $660 though as last week they had upped the price of the kits to 740. :) Hopefully it should arrive this week. BTW There is an additional $15 insurance to add to that cost. You don't hear about it until you say you'll buy.

Thanks for the info about the $15 insurance. I bet the wait feels like forever for your body to arrive....:D
I've been informed that the EOS 600D will be available in March so I'm gonna wait till it's release and compare the prices. If the grey KISS X5 is good value then I'm gonna decide on that, else it'll be the KISS X4.

C.J.

kexkez
16-02-2011, 9:42pm
The camera arrived on Tuesday. I'm regional WA and things usually take at least 2 days once in Perth. Pretty good going for something that left HK on saturday. The tracking details were excellent.

TraamisVOS
17-02-2011, 11:40pm
Never bought a grey market DLSR body but I wouldn't have a problem with it.

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joele
20-02-2011, 10:45am
I bought a Panasonic G2 not that long ago from HK, it was around $440 shipped (new in box), that is around half the local price... :th3:

TraamisVOS
20-02-2011, 12:01pm
I bought a Panasonic G2 not that long ago from HK, it was around $440 shipped (new in box), that is around half the local price... :th3:
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joele
20-02-2011, 9:17pm
The book thing is stupid, they introduce these protectionist policies to protect local publishers and totally destroy the retail end of the industry.. even more jobs lost as a result!! :confused013

I admit I also buy books from the UK, I refuse to pay around $40-$50 for a new release hard cover at borders when I can buy it from the UK for $20 shipped to my door.. (These kinds of price difference were still there even before the Aussie dollar rose, so they shouldn't blame that)..

TraamisVOS
20-02-2011, 9:53pm
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Admiral
26-02-2011, 7:47am
I'm currently in the market for some new gear, and there's something about grey market products that raises the hair on my back a little.

Part of me thinks that even though I'll be paying a bit more, I want to know that I've got that extra level of cover and service from buying locally. Which completely flies in the face of my usual tightness when it comes to money!

muggins
26-02-2011, 9:42am
I voted no, i would not buy a a grey market body, but i have purchased a Sigma 150-500 lens grey market due to the large price difference.
If a lens goes wrong most people have other lenses to carry on with but if a camera body breaks down unless you have a back up body no more pix until the body is repaired/replaced .

yongkun
07-03-2011, 12:18pm
Definitely a grey set, but just test it extensively when it comes, so you can return it if it is not functioning well. Other than that, i doubt much equipment can breakdown in 12 months time unless you are unlucky. Bought a grey tamron lens and sigma flash, which are way cheaper than local prices. :th3:

ElectricImages
06-04-2011, 7:46am
I got my 5D Mark II body, 50mm f/1.4, and first 580EXII Speedlite from a local Aussie retailer, before I discovered the grey market. I wish I'd made my initial purchases via grey import too - would have saved me well over $1000 - enough for at least one more L lens! :/

tomee
09-04-2011, 10:47pm
i bought my camera grey and purchased mack warranty for it

gabber
11-05-2011, 9:50am
My camera body was bought here in Aus from a brick and mortar store. 3 out of my 6 lenses purchased have been grey market from HK though. The cost savings was just too much to look past.

A best mate has also just purchased a Canon 60D kit from HK just recently. He wasn't sure if he should just pony up the extra dollars to buy one here, but the savings must've been to hard to pass up.

If the price for dslr gear was even similar to what the yanks and asia get then I wouldn't think twice about getting all my gear from a local photo store.

chrisprendergast
11-05-2011, 10:04am
ive owned several grey market bodies never had a single problem so i cant really comment on the service / repair side though

wind
13-05-2011, 1:01pm
In the past I've bought a Nikon 50mm f/1.8, 24-70mm, 70-200mm VR II, SB-900 and a range of bits and pieces with no problems at all. Delivery has always been prompt (within a week) and I've saved well over $1000 compared to buying from an authorised dealer.

Haven't had a problem so far but repairs are carried out by authorised Nikon repairers and reimbursed by the seller if it's still under warranty. Pretty good I think considering the prices we're forced to pay in Australia unfortunately.

Roo
21-05-2011, 2:18pm
Interesting thread and replies. My recent camera purchase I bought the body locally and the lens's, bits and bobs from HK. I was talked out of buying the body OS and in hindsight I should have stuck to my guns but meh.

I find it funny the arguments used by some to support local business etc but I ask this question. Stores like Seven 11, Food Plus started up back in the days when we had Milk Bars in residential areas but they were squeezed out of the market place due to market competition be it price and or opening hours, convenience etc. Harvey Norman, Bunnings, Dick Smith etc and the like have grown and are now offer large ranges of product at what is deemed by many as competitive pricing but they to have squeezed out the small retail shops owned by the mums and dads. It is interesting to read that the large stores are crying about the loss of market share, which is expected to grow exponentially each year, they certainly did not mind it when they were squeezing their competitors out of the market.

But remember, the people saying to support local, why did you stop supporting your local mum and dad stores years back? Was it price? Because it certainly was not customer service, I think we can all agree you receive better customer service from a mum and dad owned business than a girl/guy working in K-Mart etc ;)

jackdaw
25-08-2011, 8:16am
I have no probblems with grey. Huge savings and warranty can be covered with an aftermarket extended warranty for cheap.

kjeems
25-08-2011, 1:13pm
Bought my 60D and lens from HK. Very happy with the service. The company i went with even have a door to door warranty service where if you need to raise a claim they will organise a courier to come to your house to pick up the camera and ship it back to HK. Haven't had to use this option yet but if you don't rely on your camera for income then it's a good option.

Saved about 50% on the price.

olympuse620
11-09-2011, 11:11am
Will never buy grey again. Purchased a flash unit from an aussie site, was shipped to me direct from HK. First time out it did not work. Had put brand new batteries in it. Swapped batteries out of my other unit, and put the new batteries into the working unit (used this set up for the rest of the shoot). Sent back to shop in Sydney, they sent it to their warranty claim company, they sent it to HK for warranty. In HK they say first it is not warranty because of water damage, then the story changed, now not warranty because of battery acid leakage from the batteries. I know that neither of these are the case. This is because the unit was stored in a pelikan case from the time it arrived to me, the batteries were brand spanking new (powerex - fantastic product) Try talking direct with company in HK, language barrier a problem, ask for photos of damage to be emailed to me (did not ever happen). Six months later got my unit back at the extra cost of $299 dollars, now the unit is more expensive than if purchased through proper dealer. So I will not go grey/gray again.

PhotoPaul
11-09-2011, 5:46pm
I have bought grey lenses and a second hand body. If I were to buy a more serious body, I think I'd haggle a local store to come in close to a grey price. I'm happy to pay 10-15% more than a grey price to retain warranty in Oz if it's not valid from the grey.

This is really interesting to read too, btw, as I work in musical instrument retail and we've been suffering from the grey market for years. I know, from our cost prices, that the money is made by the wholesalers, not the retailers (nowadays a retailer would be hard pressed to make more than 15% off a Maton, for example), and most of them still have their heads in the sand as far as how badly the grey market is impacting their sales. We hassled Roland Australia (who import Boss guitar pedals) for three years before they finally dropped their retail prices (off which our costs are determined) to compete with the grey pricing. All good that they did it, but it was three years too late. You could buy a DS1 from the US for 2/3 of our wholesale price! The public have had three years of thinking we're just greedy retailers and now they're laughing at us.

We're lucky that we concentrate on in-store customer service (great attitudes, helpful, honest etc), have ridiculous back-up support (I've taken hire amps to people an hour away just so they can gig, no charge), and have two valve amp specialists and I'm a guitar tech. The service side saves us. Perhaps it's time that the wholesalers/importers took a look at what's actually going on and do something to ensure world parity pricing. The wholesalers that have done that within the music industry have grown, the others haven't and, I dare say, many will go close down in the next few years. If the retailers can't sell them, they can't buy them and then the wholesalers go down. If anyone here works in camera retail, I'd be interested to know if the situation is the same and happy to discuss what the musical instrument wholesalers have done that has been successful.

PS: This isn't an ad for where I work, I'm just discussing the parallels.

gw.toad
25-09-2011, 7:53am
I bought my camera from DDP in Sydney [grey stock] It came with a 12 month DDP warranty that wasn't needed...Saved 7 hundred $

KeeFy
29-09-2011, 3:02pm
Purchased on the 27th via DWI. Arriving today :D

Bennymiata
29-01-2012, 4:58pm
I have been buying most of my camera stuff grey for quite a while and have saved thousands.

Even in the old days, I travelled to Hong Kong quite often and bought my stuff there.
If you do buy grey, try and buy your stuff from a reputable web site, and not some shonky, faceless Chinese site where they don't care about repeat business.

If the local price is only 10-15% higher, then I'll buy locally, but until the importers of camera equipment start living in the real world (especially those that are owned and run from their Japanese HQ's) I won't buy from local stock.
How is that their cameras RETAIL in Hong kong and the US (without bargaining) for far less than the local retailers can by them for?
Because they are trying to rip us off.

They could get away with it years ago when importing stuff was more difficult, but people are a bit smarter nowdays and the time will come, sooner rather than later, when the importers will start going broke because the retailers can't sell their products and the dumb public won't buy them either.

It's not just cameras either.
Take shoes for example.
If you go to a US department store and buy some Pumas or Nikes, you will pay around $35-$45 a pair, yet the same shoes here retail for $200.
Cars are just as bad.
A Porshe in the US costs $74K, yet the same car here, with less options, cost $220K.
WHY?????
Because they think we're stupid and will pay the price.
The trouble is with cars, that even if you go to England and buy a RHD Porsche over there, and bring it back, while you will save a shedload of money on it, even after taxes etc., the government won't register it because the Porsche importers hold the compliance plate and they won't comply your car even though it is exactly the same as the one you imported privately, unless you have owned and driven it for over 18 months.
A lot of the motor vehicle ADR's are not for our protection, but the protection of ripp-off importers.

I understand that our labour rates are higher than many overseas countries, and we have NO import duty on camera gear, and that we have a 10% GST (unlike most of Europe where it is 20-25%), yet our prices here are 40% above most other countries.
Our retailers here don't make much margin on cameras, so it is the importers and distributors that are making all the cream, until they either wake up to themselves or go broke, taking the retailers right along with them.

I @ M
29-01-2012, 5:20pm
I understand that our labour rates are higher than many overseas countries, and we have NO import duty on camera gear, and that we have a 10% GST (unlike most of Europe where it is 20-25%), yet our prices here are 40% above most other countries.
Our retailers here don't make much margin on cameras, so it is the importers and distributors that are making all the cream, until they either wake up to themselves or go broke, taking the retailers right along with them.

As a prime example, the English are always complaining about how they get it in the neck regarding high prices as well compared to the rest of the world ---- but ---- comparing prices on an expensive Nikon D3x body between a high priced UK dealer and a similarly high priced Australian dealer the poms haven't got too much to complain about at the moment.

Grays of Westminster (http://www.graysofwestminster.co.uk/products/specials.php) price converted on the current exchange rate and including 20% vat = AUD $7496.00

Vanbar (http://www.vanbar.com.au/catalogue/product.php?id=63020) of Carlton (http://www.vanbar.com.au/catalogue/product.php?id=63020) :D price on special = AUD $9709.00

Who is kidding who? :confused013

Sylar
29-01-2012, 9:17pm
A body i would be a little cautious but hey they are all made in the same factory at the same time and have the same international warranty. Its more laying out a few grand and hopping that the seller on the other end is honest, if its an ebay/paypal purchase then hey ya protected so why not....says i while browsing ebay for a canon 5D :D
I know the arguments for and against buying grey imports and how it hurts the bricks and mortar stores and you dont get the 1on1 time with sales people but hey my tamron 90mm sent for HK was $400 posted and the same lens in shops ranged around the $600 so i saved a 1/3rd of the cost. I know its not transport, asia is so close so do the camera shops make one hell of a mark up or dose the middle man/importer make a killing? is it as simple as supply and demand and hear in OZ demand isnt the same? regardless paying hundreds if not thousands more for something just because its bought from a shopfront im sure is little comfort for us end users!

I @ M
29-01-2012, 10:08pm
A body i would be a little cautious but hey they are all made in the same factory at the same time and have the same international warranty.

Best of luck with your international warranty.
I guess if you believe e$ay sellers who tell you that a camera body has that international warranty then you deserve what you get. :rolleyes:

Bennymiata
30-01-2012, 3:09pm
As far as bodies and lenses go, the International Waaranty menas you have send it back to where you bought it from.

If that was overseas, then that's international isn't it?

Actually, there's no such thing as an International Warranty as the warranties are handled by the local importer, and if you didn't buy it locally, it does'nt exist.

Buying grey does have it's problems, but if you are buying name brand products, your chances of getting a dud from overseas is EXACTLY the same as getting a dud locally.

Sylar
30-01-2012, 6:04pm
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Redgum
30-01-2012, 6:56pm
Actually international warranties do exist especially on video and photographic equipment and my experience is that those warranties are clearer and more effective than similar local warranties that often have pages of exclusions. You just need to remember that warranties apply differently in most countries. As in Australia the difficulty in getting warranty service is the retailer/Distributor who doesn't make any money out of repairs. Legitimate manufacturers usually have good warranty service even if it is slow at times.
Local and on-line retailers with an Australian ABN number will probably use the same repairer (nominated by the manufacturer/representative) and in most cases pays the same fee. I have found on a number of occasions that grey market repairs have been quicker and cheaper than direct through Nikon (in my case). Same applies in the television industry.

Oh! and I paid just under $5k for my D3x (grey market) two years ago. Still firing.

kiwi
30-01-2012, 7:20pm
I'll quote Nikon Australia, talking about Camera Bodies only

http://ww2.nikon.com.au/warranty.php


"**WARNING** Please be wary of dealers claiming to be able to sell or provide you an international warranty for digital equipment when you are purchasing overseas. THIS WILL NOT BE A VALID NIKON WARRANTY. An international warranty is unavailable for the above items."

Redgum
30-01-2012, 9:17pm
Thanks Kiwi for raising that statement. This is the deception that others have talked about earlier. Two distinctions here - buying equipment overseas (whilst on holidays) and buying equipment overseas via on-line retailer (so called grey market). All manufacturers (in OECD countries) MUST provide a warranty. This also applies in most other countries, particularly China and most of Asia. It is quite true that this is not a NIKON warranty but neither is the warranty provided by Australian resellers through normal channels here. Warranty in Australia, as in most countries, is provided by a separate organisation. The word "International" only applies if the warranty extends past the country of origin. Most don't, hence the reason why equipment must be returned for repair in source country.
Legitimate dealers (including on-line) will source their warranty from the same source in each country (makes sense) but distributors in this country (called NIKON but really a subsidiary) would like you to think that only THEY can provide a warranty - simply not true.
In fact, for less than the cost of warranty (read exorbitant cost in Australia) you can insure you own gear for damage/loss through most Insurers and this makes far more sense than paying thousands to NIKON simply for the privilege of buying locally.
In reality, warranty is only of concern in this country if you pay through the nose for it. Alternatives are simple and inexpensive.

mini696
31-01-2012, 11:53am
I have, and I would again. Same product for a lower cost, and sometimes the warranty isn't affected.

macmich
06-02-2012, 3:47pm
i bought my 7d through dwi and i had a problem with the flash
i sent it back for them to check out and had a new camera within a week
cheers macca

Lazyshooter
06-02-2012, 4:16pm
I bought my D7000 locally and I am quite happy that I did. First off, I got an excellent price (managers special and then a further 10% off I think). Then on top of that, I was going overseas so I got another ~10% off). The camera has a problem with the small LCD screen so luckily I can just go back to the store to replace the camera.

seastorm
06-03-2012, 3:51pm
Not sure if this is dinkum, but looks like Nikon will pricematch grey imports

http://smarthouse.com.au/Digital_Photography/Industry/A9P7P5N4

Frog42
06-03-2012, 10:14pm
I have bought grey market bodies and will again. I have also elected to buy Australian bodies but it depends on the price difference as a proportion of the Australian price and the perceived value of purchasing Australian. The cheaper the body and the greater the price difference, the more likely I am to purchase grey. It varies between brands but Australian 'distributors' generally offer poor value for the premium they charge.

keithinmelbourne
22-04-2012, 3:27pm
I voted 'yes', but only if I am buying a cheaper body, say a 7D. I wouldn't use the grey market for a Canon 5D3 because it has teething problems and it is a bit over-priced. Nor would I buy a 1 series. Anything below $2K seems like a reasonable risk.

Eberbachl
24-04-2012, 5:39pm
I have to drop in here to say I'm happy to report I just picked up a screaming deal on a K-5 at DCW. Fantastic to see a local retailer bringing it to the grey importers. They had a better price than anyone I could find, eBay sellers included.

Arg
04-05-2012, 11:17am
I have to drop in here to say I'm happy to report I just picked up a screaming deal on a K-5 at DCW. Fantastic to see a local retailer bringing it to the grey importers. They had a better price than anyone I could find, eBay sellers included.

Obviously not the $1159 on their website? So how does one get the screaming deal?

Eberbachl
04-05-2012, 2:41pm
On their website, listed below the body only price, it's $1349 for a K-5 body, an SMC Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 AL WR lens, an extra (genuine Pentax) D-L190 battery, and a Sigma EF-530 DG Super flash.

;)

Snpsht
19-07-2012, 5:30pm
- - - Updated - - -

The (chain) stores in my local area don't seem particularly willing to negotiate, but I got an excellent price on the Pentax K-5 when it came on special. Could have got it a little cheaper online, but decided I wanted a full and local warranty.

They seem, however, unwilling to negotiate on other stuff. So far I have bought 1 lens from DWI and returned it because the motor was incredibly noisy and the lens refused to focus properly (I am a beginner, so got my neighbour who is an experienced pfotographer to check out the settings etc and he couldn't get it working either), so I sent it back and they gave a prompt and courteous refund as I didn't feel confident ordering another one....my nervousness as a beginner photographer cutting in, and no reflection on their service.

Then had a slightly different lens sent from eGlobal (same company, I think) and it arrived extremely promptly and works perfectly.

Have also had a cheap Sigma sent from dcxpert in Melbourne - came with full Aus warranty and was lots cheaper than anywhere else.....good experience, so have ordered another (different) cheapie from them which should arrive on Monday.

For around $800 I now have 3 lenses (plus a very basic kit lens) which are excellent for a beginner/intermediate, and one of them will see me right through to advanced level (if I ever get there!). Had I ordered from my local shop I would have paid around double that.

chaosboi
22-07-2012, 10:51pm
I live close to grey market online retailer, although I have a well known major camera store a little closer. I always try to haggle the major outlet first, and if the price isn't far off, I'll make the purchase at the major retailer.
I'm not shy to tell them what I'm doing, but I always say the I understand they can't match grey market prices.
i hope they pass on to their reps that they are potentionally losing business to grey market sellers, as this may assist in bringing prices down.

Sifor
23-07-2012, 8:14am
I wouldn't buy a grey body/lens because I usually get a fantastic price from my JB store...

Take for example my new D800 and Nikon 24-70 2.8 lens. Picked up the body for $3350 and the lens $1680.. which are about $100 more than grey prices yet I get 2 years warranty.

I will, however, be buying a Nikon speedlight grey in the near future. Not much that can go wrong with them and the big stores aren't playing ball.